# Downtown hotels **URL:** \ **Category:** New Construction\ **Created:** [May 26, 2018, 9:34pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161 "2018-05-26T21:34:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 62
**Author:** ![Unique12b](https://community.dtraleigh.com/user_avatar/community.dtraleigh.com/unique12b/32/744_2.png) [@Unique12b](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/Unique12b)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 5:54pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1316 "2024-02-21T17:54:05Z")
This from the article worries me “The City of Raleigh has pushed back on the plans, citing a requirement for the building to be “mixed-use.” That can be achieved by having an independently run restaurant or retail space on the ground floor of the hotel. A food truck or a hotel-run restaurant will not fulfill that requirement, according to the city.” ---
**Author:** ![John](https://community.dtraleigh.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/j/a3d4f5/32.png) [@John](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/John)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 5:59pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1317 "2024-02-21T17:59:44Z")
I don’t think that sort of requirement is insurmountable. It sure doesn’t sound like a game stopping issue. ---
**Author:** ![Alan](https://community.dtraleigh.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/a/a87d85/32.png) [@Alan](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/Alan)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 6:03pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1318 "2024-02-21T18:03:30Z")
Where’s the hole in the building for the train? ---
**Author:** ![Nickster](https://community.dtraleigh.com/user_avatar/community.dtraleigh.com/nickster/32/8765_2.png) [@Nickster](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/Nickster)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 6:17pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1319 "2024-02-21T18:17:36Z")
![image](https://d3tmycllq5yp1y.cloudfront.net/original/3X/4/4/44c30fcab37e695bd00a1c113a43af71de19ffbe.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Drew](https://community.dtraleigh.com/user_avatar/community.dtraleigh.com/drew/32/23896_2.png) [@Drew](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/Drew)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 6:20pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1320 "2024-02-21T18:20:33Z")
![image](https://d3tmycllq5yp1y.cloudfront.net/original/3X/4/1/4150bde08dcc8af69cdd9e8b2c7cf7ccfec51eb5.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![apbassett](https://community.dtraleigh.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@apbassett](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/apbassett)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 6:26pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1321 "2024-02-21T18:26:50Z")
Looks cool (and I will be very happy to get some more/better sidewalks here) But definitely concerning regarding the S-Line plans @orulz any guesses as to how this will be rectified? ---
**Author:** ![trueurbanist](https://community.dtraleigh.com/user_avatar/community.dtraleigh.com/trueurbanist/32/23903_2.png) [@trueurbanist](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/trueurbanist)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 7:10pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1322 "2024-02-21T19:10:23Z")
I could’ve sworn there was a document somewhere that mentioned that this property is out of the ROW for the S-Line? 🤨 ---
**Author:** ![Jake](https://community.dtraleigh.com/user_avatar/community.dtraleigh.com/jake/32/34692_2.png) [@Jake](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/Jake)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 7:25pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1323 "2024-02-21T19:25:24Z")
> [@apbassett](#): > > the S-Line plans I’m gonna make a bold guess here but… that ain’t happening in any of our lifetimes. This is America lmaooooo ---
**Author:** ![John](https://community.dtraleigh.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/j/a3d4f5/32.png) [@John](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/John)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 8:00pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1324 "2024-02-21T20:00:22Z")
This is Raleigh. We need a hole for a freeway. 🤣 https://www.google.com/maps/embed?pb=%213m2%212sen%214v0%216m8%211m7%211sjlQ-rLQ_5EV6djp4HQe8lg%212m2%211d41.8755374%212d-87.6370845%213f285.44%214f9.049%215f0.75 ---
**Author:** ![Deekay93](https://community.dtraleigh.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/d/d2c977/32.png) [@Deekay93](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/Deekay93)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 8:23pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1325 "2024-02-21T20:23:26Z")
Hope they move the rooftop the other direction. Currently facing towards Peace Street & Smoky Hollow. The better view would be looking over the railroad taxis onto Glenwood ---
**Author:** ![apbassett](https://community.dtraleigh.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@apbassett](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/apbassett)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 8:28pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1326 "2024-02-21T20:28:00Z")
I certainly understand being pessimistic about transit projects in general just because of… \*gestures broadly\* But the $1B of cash awarded for the _construction_ of this segment plus the fact that we’re already past the EIS indicates to me that this project is all but guaranteed… at least the Wake Forest segment. ---
**Author:** ![apbassett](https://community.dtraleigh.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@apbassett](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/apbassett)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 8:28pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1327 "2024-02-21T20:28:55Z")
I hope this is the case! ---
**Author:** ![Nickster](https://community.dtraleigh.com/user_avatar/community.dtraleigh.com/nickster/32/8765_2.png) [@Nickster](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/Nickster)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2024, 8:33pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1328 "2024-02-21T20:33:35Z")
Atlanta says… Look what we did ![image](https://d3tmycllq5yp1y.cloudfront.net/original/3X/4/8/48bc377206c409a3cfdc315a5ed8ecef90f959eb.jpeg) Then New York is like… Dude Hold my beer ![image](https://d3tmycllq5yp1y.cloudfront.net/original/3X/3/6/36b0ec643250832e94262f7d6ce50346761cebf1.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![zoso](https://community.dtraleigh.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/z/bcef8e/32.png) [@zoso](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/zoso)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2024, 3:14am UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1329 "2024-02-22T03:14:53Z")
This is in ASR review and yes there is required mix use for first floor. There is a public portal that anyone can look up the comments for ASR or SUB plans. Do I need to put a link for it on here? ---
**Author:** ![zoso](https://community.dtraleigh.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/z/bcef8e/32.png) [@zoso](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/zoso)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2024, 3:22am UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1330 "2024-02-22T03:22:16Z")
here is link public portal [https://raleighnc-energovpub.tylerhost.net/apps/selfservice#/search](https://raleighnc-energovpub.tylerhost.net/apps/selfservice#/search) put in ASR-0011-2023 when it shows up click on reviews and then arrow down on comments. It should show the comments from each trade. I use this too much and can put detailed instructions if needed. ---
**Author:** ![GucciLittlePig](https://community.dtraleigh.com/user_avatar/community.dtraleigh.com/guccilittlepig/32/25831_2.png) [@GucciLittlePig](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/GucciLittlePig)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2024, 4:29am UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1331 "2024-02-22T04:29:06Z")
Agreed. Couldn’t the developer just form a separate shell company to be a hotel restaurant, and then sell them to the hotel operator for $1 after it’s built? Or anything easier and less sketchy? ---
**Author:** ![orulz](https://community.dtraleigh.com/user_avatar/community.dtraleigh.com/orulz/32/3808_2.png) [@orulz](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/orulz)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2024, 11:23am UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1332 "2024-02-22T11:23:11Z")
The only alternative to building the S-line on the Moxy hotel property would be to buy land from Norfolk Southern. This would actually be a better option _if it could happen_, but there is absolutely no way to compel them to sell even one square inch of their right of way, short of an act of congress. Municipal and state authorities do not have eminent domain over railroads. Back around 2015, when this was being studied, Norfolk Southern were absolutely, categorically unwilling to play ball. Things may have changed since then, but if not, the state needs to move quickly to condemn this property before shovels hit dirt. ---
**Author:** ![orulz](https://community.dtraleigh.com/user_avatar/community.dtraleigh.com/orulz/32/3808_2.png) [@orulz](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/orulz)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2024, 3:52pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1333 "2024-02-22T15:52:03Z")
To illustrate, here are the property boundaries in the area. ![ns_row](https://d3tmycllq5yp1y.cloudfront.net/original/3X/c/8/c8333159eeaade3de3395710d817087030eb5cd7.jpeg) With Norfolk Southern’s cooperation, they could probably do something here entirely within the existing right of way, with just two tracks - but then future high speed and commuter trains will be forever stuck sharing tracks with the freight trains slowly rumbling their way in and out of the yard and through the wye. Not great. Really for adequate performance, a minimum of three tracks are probably needed here. One for slow freight headed to Glenwood Yard, and two for passenger trains. Ideally you would want to leave room for a fourth track, so the CSX tracks could be relocated here as well. I can’t imagine them planning for four tracks with anything less than 80’ right-of-way; closer to 90’ or even 100’ would probably be desirable. The ROW is 100’ wide by Moxy - so that’s wide enough, right? Well, sort of. Notice how jagged the right-of-way is. Sometimes it’s wide on the west and pinched on the east; sometimes it’s wide on the east and pinched on the west. There are several pinch points where the right-of-way narrows down to 65’ or less, so there is just simply no way to do this without some property acquisition and demolition of some buildings. The narrowest spot is between 222 Glenwood and Five Star, where it’s just 50’ wide. Of course 222 Glenwood would be massively more expensive and controversial to acquire than Five Star, so in all likelyhood (and indeed, according to the designs so far) the right-of-way would have to be expanded to the east, and Five Star has to come down. The question is, though: is it possible to put the ROW far enough east to clear 222 Glenwood, and then get back far enough west to clear Moxy, without wrecking operations by having curves that are too tight? Not sure. Just seems so much easier and less risky to NOT BUILD MOXY THERE. It’s literally a parking lot. All we have so far are renderings, and (likely incomplete) designs. So we are potentially digging ourselves into a hole where we either have to have to: 1. Acquire and demolish 222 Glenwood (evicting and relocating all the residents) 2. Acquire and demolish a brand-new Moxy Hotel 3. Go for two tracks, and make do forever with a conflict between passenger trains and freight trains (and that’s only if Norfolk Southern agrees to play ball!) 4. Just forget about this whole train thing and send the $1b back to the feds, because WE WANT MOXY, and (insert predictable reason here: autonomous vehicles, hyperloops, work from home, choo choos are old fashioned, etc) ---
**Author:** ![John](https://community.dtraleigh.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/j/a3d4f5/32.png) [@John](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/John)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2024, 4:48pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1334 "2024-02-22T16:48:05Z")
> [@orulz](#): > > Acquire and demolish 222 Glenwood (evicting and relocating all the residents) You don’t evict owners. You buy them out. ---
**Author:** ![orulz](https://community.dtraleigh.com/user_avatar/community.dtraleigh.com/orulz/32/3808_2.png) [@orulz](https://community.dtraleigh.com/u/orulz)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2024, 4:51pm UTC](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161/1335 "2024-02-22T16:51:50Z")
OK, you got me! I used the wrong word! But then again, on further thought, did I? Do you suppose that everybody in that building is an owner-occupant? I’d be extremely surprised if a significant chunk of those units aren’t owned by investors who rent them out. Chances are, under an eminent domain scenario, the state would take posession of the units while they are still occupied, and then move forward with relocation and eviction if necessary. [Previous page](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161.md?page=61) [Next page](https://community.dtraleigh.com/t/downtown-hotels/161.md?page=63)