Peace at West (Smokey Hollow)


Each one costs 1945/mo


Is that materials demonstration for Peace? Please, no orange!


Yeah this sample wall is directly across the street from peace


Going to look really bad after 5 years.


It already looks bad on the sample board. Thankfully paint exists as a thing.


Publix paperwork are being reviewed now for permits in Smokey Hollow Project .


They are just now getting to the paperwork for the store? What does that mean? Are you talking about the permits for the fit-up work with the city?


The fit-up work with the city .


That no bars are allowed in the Dillon will sort of put brakes on that. I think it peaked, and has been at a peak, for a good 10 years or so. All the same spaces keep rotating bars now, West End/Circa 1888. Aries/Ugly Monkey. Wicked Smile/5 Star. Crank Arm had that crime themed place before it. There aren’t any new places to put more, because, you know. Raleigh’s retail suitable building stock is terrible.


What’s up with “no bars are allowed in the Dillon?” Is that a regulations/zoning thing or a developer thing?


Concession that Kay got from Kane at the behest of a resident in the Dawson.


Ah yes, DrunkTown™ with its despicable string lights.


Probably not the Dawson and more likely Boylan Heights. I live over there and several of us had been long suffering from hearing Club Bodi’s music inside our houses from midnight to 5am Th-Sun at the time the Dillon concessions were made. I’m definitely not in the Drunk Town camp, but when you can’t sleep four nights of the week because of thumping club music, you get mad.

We’ve been living downtown for 10+ years, five of those next to a party house off Glenwood, so we’re used to urban noise. We could hear Club Bodi in our bedroom (with a noise machine on) like it was across the street. Acoustics are interesting, and when you have a business owner who considers noise ordinance violations as a cost of doing business and doesn’t care about the surrounding neighbors, then you get concessions like that. We just wanted mutual respect. And sleep from midnight to 5am.


I’m paraphrasing what I read in the N&O, and the resident was a Dawson resident. Whether or not he and Crowder actually spoke one on one I do not know…but the article implied the transitive connection. Makes no difference to me if there are bars in Dillon or not. It was probably that loud in your unit because there are only a few layers of tissue paper between you and the amps. Modern construction standards, while full of electrical, fire, insulation and minimum load bearing guidelines, have no such guideline for noise transmission that I am aware of. Back in my HOA presidential days, we studied it a lot because you could hear microwave buttons being pushed in the next unit…so you could hear everything. All of the time.


Yet there are loud bars between Dawson and Dillon.


I don’t know the details of who convinced Crowder to negotiate the concession, but she was well aware of the issues we were having.

I was just trying to head off the nimby comments (not from you specifically), because every once in awhile, there is a legitimate reason for some things that may seem unreasonable at first glance. :woman_shrugging:

I live in a single family house, about .2 miles away from the Dillon. I totally agree with you about modern construction and acoustics, but I shouldn’t be hearing music originating from inside a club .2 miles away from me like it’s next door. The business owner should have sound proofed his building if that was the type of business he wanted in a building not meant for such a business. Part of this whole saga reveals an issue with the city’s nuisance ordinance enforcement: there is no penalty if the violator is willing to repeatedly pay fines.


In many cities, the fines rapidly escalate with each subsequent incident, often culminating in losing ones liquor license. That usually does the trick.


Why does it have to be a ban on all bars? Not all bars are loud and obnoxious. Reminds me of the old Politician’s Syllogism - Something must be done. This is something. Therefore we must do this.

It’s a complete overreaction and a petty display of entitlement.


Or as interpreted by ‘Yes, Minister’ (anyone watch that show? I highly recommend it)

All cats have four legs.
My dog has four legs.
Therefore my dog is a cat.


My thoughts would be to somehow force all bars and clubs to contain their sound (like John’s mention of escalating fines e.g.) and not wade into micro location bans, especially where, by zoning, they are otherwise allowed.