South Park Neighborhood - Warehouse Developments and Cargill Site


So, although this is slightly outside of many folks’ definitions of downtown (based on the other thread), I’ve been wondering if anyone has any insight on what may become of the old Cargill location, recently demolished and now idle. Additionally there’s the block bounded by Bragg, Branch, Blount, and Person, which used to be warehouses but was cleared a couple years ago. There’s actual activity on site this week and I’m very hopeful for something mixed-use or at least retail/office. I thought I read it was a brownfield site at one point and maybe they’re just doing mitigation on it, but is there a new owner or is the current owner looking to sell in what is a rapidly-gentrifying neighborhood? Anybody know anything?


Google the SGCS Southern Gateway Corridor Study It’s a huge download but worth it. I see a similar vision as here. But with all the people they are trying to move in over here (I’m already there) there had better be some retail ASAP or everyone will move out as fast as they moved in. The closest grocery on the South side is in Garner


The activity at the S Blount/S Person Block continued over the last three weeks. They dug out some massive old tanks and broke some of the concrete up. According to wake county real estate records there is no owner transfer yet. I try to snap some pictures over the weekend


A lot of straw bales on site. Like they are going to throw temporary grass seed down and do nothing for awhile.


I still love to see something other than just open land.


Or Even this.


A post was merged into an existing topic: Raleigh Stadium/Arena Discussions


The Triangle continues to be “punished” for neither having a massively large core city population nor a singular MSA that best describes the population of the area.
Many people would be surprised to learn that the Raleigh MSA alone now has more people than New Orleans, Buffalo, and (likely) Memphis based on average growth rates, and the two combined MSAs (Raleigh+Durham) have many more people than the MSAs and CSA’s of Jacksonville, FL, OKC, or Milwaukee. All of these comparative cities are pro sports cities for either the NBA, NFL, MLB or some combo of them.
As of last July, the combined MSA populations of Raleigh’s and Durham’s MSAs was also bang on Nashville’s but that number is achieved in less than 62% of the land area of Nashville’s MSA. If growth rates continued as they have been, Raleigh+Durham is now larger than Nashville, but who would know it?

While Milwaukee, New Orleans, and Buffalo are legacy markets, Nashville, OKC and Jacksonville all have bloated municipal limits that push their rankings up the charts. At over 500 square miles, more than triple the land area of Raleigh, Nashville is the smallest of the three expansion cities in land area. Imagine if Raleigh had 500 square miles of land. That would be like Raleigh+Cary+Apex+Morrisville+Holly Springs+Wake Forest + Garner+Knightdale + more than 200 more square miles of land to add to match Nashville. It would also put “Raleigh’s” municipal population near 830,000 while still remaining physically smaller than Charlotte by a couple dozen square miles.
People will say that how these invisible lines are counted or not counted doesn’t matter. I don’t agree with them. Raleigh and the Triangle continue to be shortchanged by the basic metrics that are typically used to measure cities. Even the Amazon HQ2 articles floating around the Internet call us a metro of 1.2 million. Not only is that number off by more than 100,000 for just the Raleigh MSA alone, it continues to ignore that the west side of the Triangle even exists. Until something changes, expect our national visibility to be a challenge.


Great read about what’s going on just southeast of downtown Raleigh.


I may need to break down and get a subscription to the Triangle Biz Journal. Maybe my company will go halfsies with me!


Great and thorough piece about the neighborhood I call home for good 4 years. Back then only a crazy person would buy something south of MLK. 6 years ago you would go over red lights there not to stop your car in the hood. Boy has the area changed


We don’t have the population density or the civic will to support a commuter rail.


Buffalo’s metro population may only be around a million people but its a small part of a larger urban mega region that stretches from Rochester to Toronto. Buffalo’s sports teams draw from much more than Buffalo MSA and quite successfully so. 20% of the Bills crowd is Canadian and Rochester is just as die hard for the Sabres and the Bills as anyone from Buffalo.


Is there a metric for population density that supports commuter rail? I keep hearing this refrain, but never seem to come across anything specific that indicates what IS needed. Would it be employment centers w/ ___jobs/sq.mi being near housing centers w/ ___people/sq.mi? Or is it simply a number of riders looking to get to a specific job center?

The State of Downtown Report (referenced on @dtraleigh’s blog) indicates that Raleigh has 47,000 urban workers, and 8,500 residents (16,900 w/in 1 mile of DTR). The State of Downtown Durham Report indicates 18,500 urban workers and 14,600 w/in 1 mile of DTD. The RTP website says 50,000+ work there (not super specific). The triangle as a whole has 2M+ people.

Perhaps it’s a density along a given corridor that justifies the expense? Anyone have any references that can back up the “requirements” for commuter rail or other forms of public transit?


Drove by today and they were still out there working. Maybe 10 trucks and some heavy machinery. Anyone know what they’re doing?