Oooh my bad. It sounded to me like more of a “Raleigh is better than the rest of y’all” thing at first, but I got what you meant now.
In that case, yeah… I think GoTriangle definitely messed up with their strategies, back then But I think their mistakes run much longer than Raleigh dropping the ball in the Wake Light Rail idea.
The whole idea of DOLRT started when a Major Investment Study said some sort of rail connection between Chapel Hill and Durham is worth it.
This is why you gotta pay attention to early-stage studies and keep track of politics (see: the Bush administration changing federal transit funding rules).
Board of Trustees looking into public contests for naming trains, lines, stations, etc. Though don’t expect this to happen until 2-3 years before service is online. So 10 years from now.
They gave a subtle nod to the instances where public naming contests have gone wrong. I think they’re planning on vetting the submissions and choosing their favorite instead of setting up a public poll. They also mentioned a possible prize for the winning selection, either in the form of cash or a free annual pass or something along those lines.
I mean… “much needed” for the future, right? I agree it would be necessary if/when commuter rail becomes a thing in the latter half of this decade -so it’s disappointing, sure, but I don’t think it’s something to freak out over.
There are some things related to the FAST proposal that throw a wrench into existing plans, though. But no one actually believes they’d start running by 2025, anyways.
GoTriangle released the agenda for their upcoming Board of Trustees meeting, which includes updates to major projects like commuter rail.
Does anyone know what’s going on behind the scenes? If I’m reading between the lines right, it sounds like Norfolk Southern is just taking their sweet ass time with modeling analyses, but they’re not being very transparent about it…
The very last page of the GoTriangle Board agenda for next Wednesday has a few updates related to the Greater Triangle Commuter Rail (GTCR) project. Combined with what I wrote last November, I’m starting to get two impressions that’s making me rethink my expectations, as well as how we should be discussing them on this site. Click each point for details:
Lots of key leaders and organizations aren't committed to GTCR, yet.
GoTriangle needs to secure legal agreements with rail operators NCRR and Norfolk Southern if they want to be allowed to run trains at all. But they seem to have been stuck in negotiation mode since at least October. They’ve also been engaging local governments and institutions (e.g. Duke?) in Durham and Cary since August, but GoTriangle didn’t finish directly hearing their thoughts and ideas until November.
We need all of these stakeholders’ cooperation to show we can raise the money and ridership to make GTCR work, but it seems like we’re struggling with this.
Despite the hype, only a tiny number of people are actually paid to work on GTCR.
The real estate/engineering negotiations, railroad capacity studies etc. sound like things that could be done independently of each other to me, but they all seem to be happening one step at a time even before Norfolk Southern’s holdup, and even if you factor in how it’s hard to work during COVID.
This makes me wonder: does GoTriangle simply not have enough people working on this project to make it proceed as fast as Raleigh’s BRT projects?
@Kevin do you know how many GoTriangle employees are actually working on the commuter rail project? I’m sure I could guesstimate by looking at the FTEs funded through the Wake Transit work plans, but I don’t have the bandwidth to do that…
From all that I read on this thread over the past 15 months of posts, it sounds to me like it’s not certain AT ALL there will ever be commuter rail for the Triangle. Sounds like the planners need to go farther and determine if it’s even worth it, all the while the “Go Forward” group says “37 miles of commuter rail Will be built over the next 10 years.”
If I’m being honest, it really just sounds like commuter rail is wishful thinking.
Exactly! Unlike the BRT projects, no government agency has committed to making commuter rail happen yet. Wake County wants to make it happen and are trying to convince people and funders to support it; that is the whole point of all the studies and long-term regional plans that are happening. Think of the planning efforts so far as a startup investment.
And if that feels outrageous to you, remember that the whole point of studies is to learn exactly that before you shell out the funds for a full project execution.
One minor point, though: the “Go Forward group” is not some shady lobbying group; it’s literally just GoTriangle, GoRaleigh, CAMPO, and other transit agencies and planning organizations in the Triangle. That’s their combined brand to raise public awareness about regional transit plans.
I believe there is one person working full-time on it and another person who probably works 50% on it, with other people pulled in as needed. A lot of this heavy lifting should be done by the consultants, I would think.
I have said this and others in the transit realm here have agreed: you’ll see commuter rail service on the Wake Forest to Apex “S” line before you see it in the Durham-Clayton corridor. That’s a combination of NCDOT’s institutional knowledge and capacity with passenger rail vs. GoTriangle as well as a corridor that has fewer design challenges and freight companies more willing to play ball.
GoTriangle should hire NCDOT Rail as the contractor for Clayton to Durham commuter rail, end of story, full stop. They have a vested interest in the NCRR? Great. Then pay them to have a vested interest in running commuter trains on it.
But I think their mistakes run much longer than Raleigh dropping the ball in the Wake Light Rail idea.
(see: the Bush administration changing federal transit funding rules).
