Great - leave it to Durham to derail yet another rail project.
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If Durham does this I will do everything in my power to shun and avoid that city out of spite.
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GoTriangle uploaded a recording of their meeting! I don’t have the time to really look into how their staff handled the Q&A portion of the event, but here’s what I noticed from their slides (disclaimers):
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Most station locations were not a surprise. NCSU’s is next to Yarborough Dr., West Durham’s is across Durham Freeway from Duke’s North Pavilion, etc. Remember that the presentation’s station locations are still just a high-level overview, though, and is more like a market analysis than engineering/design activities (since, obviously, we’re not there yet!!!). But the slides are giving lawmakers the evidence-backed credibility to say there’s transit-oriented development opportunities (instead of all the imaginary hand-waving that we do on this site).
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A part of why the commuter rail study’s taking so long is because they’re trying to make the case for rail as strong as possible -including ways to clap back at concerns like the opinion piece @orulz linked to. They’re doing this through four mini-studies that will teach GoTriangle what they’re dealing with and how they could make residents’ lives better or worse:
- Affordable Housing (already finished!)
- Travel Market
- Land Use
- Economic Impact
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Corporation Center Dr. is added as a station candidate location due to its proximity to WakeMed Park and affordable housing. Interestingly, though, Park West Village in Morrisville didn’t. (I wonder if the Town of Morrisville could be pushing harder to do that?)
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Morrisville and Cary DGAF about this. Morrisville basically thinks “We got our station (at McCrimmon) so we’re fine” and Cary thinks “It’s in Morrisville so it has nothing to do with us.” It drives me crazy.
There are some legitimate reasons that putting a station there may be harder than at some of the other spots on the line, but then again I can’t see how it’s any harder than what they’re planning to do at (eg) Downtown Cary. The issues are solvable. It would cost money, but since it’s already been dropped, we don’t even know how much money it would cost and we aren’t going to find out. There are some factors, like: if they get trains with retractable, gap-filling bridge plates, then curved platforms may be possible, that they have decided to not even consider.
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Y’all, this is one person’s op-ed. And it’s someone who’s not even in any position related to transit decisions in Durham… I personally don’t give it much weight or think it’s representative of overall opinion here.
As much as I hate to say it though, I also think they make a reasonable point. I of course see the value in commuter rail, and my response to this survey listed it as a top priority because I see it as an opportunity to be a catalyst for dense, transit-oriented development and the backbone for regional public transit expansion. But there is still a perception that bus improvements would go much further in improving the lives of all the folks who actually use transit today – most of whom use it as their primary or only form of transportation to get anywhere they need to go – while rail is a vanity project oriented towards affluent folks with white-collar jobs. I understand why this perception exists, and I sympathize with the frustration of bus-riders who feel overlooked.
That said, I want both bus improvements and rail. And I think it would be incredibly stupid and shortsighted to delay commuter rail because our bus system isn’t as great as it should be.
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And a huge amount of new apartments nearby and future housing build-up potential. The currently industrial land between Chapel Hill Rd and Hillsborough looks ripe for mid-density mix-use projects PLUS NO Single Family Housing butting up for future NIMBYism.
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Yet the folks who use transit tomorrow may, or may not, be the same as the folks who use transit today.
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100%. I don’t think the op-ed was unreasonable, I think people are rightfully noting that the current commuter rail plan is heavily titled towards affluent, white-collar jobs and, even worse, an economic development tool to “check the box” for the Triangle having a rail line at all.
I would love, love commuter rail in this area in part for the reasons mentioned above BUT I don’t think those reasons alone are enough to justify it. Under the current plan, who else is getting helped out? Real estate developers, maybe. But right now they’re designing a commuter rail service model for a 9-to-5 commuting crowd that has been shrunk significantly post-COVID.
The most frustrating part is that GoTriangle was supposed to undertake this huge exploratory study to see whether commuter rail at 8-2-8-2 was worth the massive investment it would take. Instead, I get the impression that they’ve made their decision to pursue it and are backfilling the study in order for it to fit their desired outcome. That wasn’t the deal, and it’s gonna alienate a lot of parter agencies and stakeholders if it hasn’t already (i.e. the op-ed).
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Can you speak more to this? This feels more like a Hanlon’s razor situation to me, so I’m curious as to where you’re coming from.
I know GoTriangle cut several corners to get the rail alignment and transit modality outcomes they wanted in the Durham-Orange light rail project’s Alternatives Analysis. Those faulty studies grew into questionable design and cost decisions, and those became the arguments Duke et al. used to kill that project. Are you saying that you think the same thing is happening now? If so, what part of the study are we missing or getting wrong?
Besides... (click me)
I think it also helps to remember that this is just a feasibility study; we only want to know through this study whether commuter rail makes sense to be built at all. That is separate and different from whether we should build it now (what the op-ed is talking about) or how should it work in our sorta-after-COVID-but-not-really world (which is also different from a truly-post-COVID world).
After all, that’s probably why the current phase of the feasibility study only defines NCRR, NCDOT, MPOs, and counties as formal stakeholders. It doesn’t even formally solicit help from individual towns and cities, yet, let alone institutions, companies, and community organizations that could be more impacted.
My take is that CR is just going to have a hard time penciling out with the costs and benefits as currently proposed. $2 billion for 8-2-8-2 service seems …off. I’m a big time advocate for fixed guideway transit, but man oh man, that’s a tough sell.
Some combination of boosting the value and cutting the costs needs to happen. Adding frequency, more routes, going faster, or adding stations on the planned route could improve the value proposition.
I’m not sure where cost cuts could come from, but for a few segments of double track and a dozen stations to cost $2b seems preposterous. It’s as if we’re getting taken for a ride by Norfolk Southern or the consultants who are doing the planning work. Something has to give.
Either or both of these (lowering costs, adding benefits) could help to assuage the concerns of the Durham crowd, but given the small amount of service planned, and the immense costs, I have to say no wonder they’re questioning it.
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Could or should cities and counties consider an extra fee or tax especially for CR? Specifically I was thinking of the fees that over-lay boundaries or districts use to assist in paying for services where those most benefit would live? If I buy or rent a home right on the CR tracks and nearest the station, would that help with cost? Sorry in advance if I am not thinking correctly? If not, blame it on the alcohol 
For your overlay tax district question, are you asking about another transit tax on top of what Wake and Durham counties already levy (both of which required new state laws and a referendum to pass)?
As for your house-buying question, I think you'd make the commuter rail cost problem worse. (click me to see why)
If you buy/rent property near a proposed station, I think you’d be a part of the problem of inflated project costs. In your thought experiment, I imagine you’d jack up the piece of the land you just speculated in (as well as other properties around it) in one of two ways:
If GoTriangle buys your new property to build a station, for example, they would have to spend more of taxpayers’ money to meet your price tag. Your land purchase would, thus, literally make the commuter rail more expensive to build. If that keeps causing decision-makers sticker shock, then you just might have derail the entire project using your land investment.
Even if that doesn’t happen, I think private developers eyeing your land would face the same problem. Your purchase would demand more resources of developers to acquire your property, so I’d think they would be incentivized to build fewer public amenities like affordable housing units.
Neither of those hypothetical situations would cut costs or add benefits, but actively do the opposite of at least one of those things. By those standards, your suggestion would not help at all.
Actual real estate people: am I understanding the market forces involved, correctly? Please feel free to correct me or chime in as you see fit.
I don’t have a strong reaction agree of disagree to the op-ed, but it kind of made three things come to my mind. #1. This seems like one of the infrequent situations where the multiple cities in the triangle might hurt each other by not coordinating. Coming from Atlanta, having a different municipality kill transit connectivity is kind of the playbook and feels more rare here. #2. (which I feel much less strong about) It made me wonder if rail like this has ever mostly benefited more wealthy people in the USA? Like if there was no MARTA today, would building it get the same critique? I don’t think anyone sees MARTA as just built for the rich. I would kind of like to see examples of that. #3. The request for better bus service in the op-ed made me thankful that Raleigh has been taking that seriously for a while now. With expanded services and BRT in the works, it doesn’t feel like anyone would point to a “lack of investment in busses” here. I guess Durham is behind on that.
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Not to give away too much insider info, but the vibe I get is that they’re constantly scrambling to meet self-imposed deadlines when information could be filtered better or given more time to be reviewed and edited appropriately. On the outside, having MAB saying things like “we NEED commuter rail” in heavy-handed promo videos sort of lets the cat out of the bag if you’re saying this is a “feasibility” study. Instead the entire process has felt like a PR pitch, hence why I think they already decided what they want to do without waiting for the facts to come in. That’s my opinion, I’m not saying I know any of this for a fact, its just how it comes off.
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Good points all. I think most suburban-to-urban commuter rail inherently benefits the white-collar commuting crowd unless it has robust all-day service in both directions like SEPTA, Metro North, etc. As for Durham, they’re behind on things after DOLRT died. I don’t use the buses in Durham and therefore my opinion doesn’t carry much weight, but from what I’ve heard it is badly in need of improvement.
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The request for better bus service in the op-ed made me thankful that Raleigh has been taking that seriously for a while now. With expanded services and BRT in the works, it doesn’t feel like anyone would point to a “lack of investment in busses” here. I guess Durham is behind on that.
I think this misses some historical context… Correct me if I’m wrong, but as I understand it, the original transit plan for the Triangle included a Durham/Orange light rail line and a Wake light rail line. Wake declined to build theirs and opted for BRT instead. Meanwhile, Durham progressed their light rail through design before it was killed. Durham was tracking to have light rail operational within a couple of years of Raleigh’s BRT lines. Now, with DOLRT gone, Durham will likely follow Wake’s lead with BRT replacing it. All this to say: Durham is years behind not just because of lack of investment in local transit, but also in large part because of the light rail fiasco.
Not sure how our bus systems compare aside from BRT though. I know Durham’s got five 15-minute frequency lines, and the one I ride is pretty reliable. Also know the bus station’s slated for a flashy revamp. No idea where we are with everything else.
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I agree that Durham as a whole, like Raleigh, is not “lack[ing in] investment in buses”. I think the difference comes from how skewed it is by region.
In June 2019, GoDurham approved a short-range transit plan that shuffled around how buses work in Durham. This plan upgraded some bus routes to run every 15min all day at a cost: it also cut several bus services that were a major part of very-low-income riders’ lives. The services were the Bull City Connector, Durham’s version of the R-Line, and bus routes in eastern Durham that served many residents in need. The latter was replaced by a rideshare subsidy, but that approach is filled with its own flaws like age, time, and frequency restrictions.
By the way, that’s not the first time those parts of Durham got passed over for infrastructure improvements.
For example... (click me!)
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Durham’s light rail attempt didn’t include a very meaningful part of eastern Durham until NC Central lobbied for an extension.
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Many of eastern and southern Durham’s bus stops are completely missing sidewalks, and their locations overlap with clusters of pedestrian injuries/deaths. The City of Durham has been trying to work on them, but they appear to have a long-enough backlog that the Bull City’s counterpart to @dtraleigh felt the need to write his own piece about it.
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Trees and other sidewalk and neighborhood improvements in Durham are more heavily clustered around western Durham. A Duke environmental scholar even found that tree canopy density correlates with segregation-era redlining maps.
Another correlation: look closely at the affiliations of the authors of the op-ed. Eastern Durham, Hayti, and Braggtown, the causes of interest for many of them, are some of the neighborhoods in Durham that were subject to those changes.
You know who else is annoying when it comes to regional rail? Norfolk Southern, the freight company that seems to like to cooperate with passenger rail as little as possible.
I ran into this article, and thought: is NS being belligerently obstructive against all passenger rail? Or are they just simply incompetent and terrible at rail scheduling? (If it’s the latter, could that mean they could become much more supportive of rail throughout the Triangle if they just learn to get their shit together?)
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I’ve read most of these links about Durham, but thanks for compiling and connecting the threads. They’re really great resources. The Duke study about tree canopy especially is such a clear illustration of the lingering effects of discriminatory urban policy.
Regarding the BCC, they didn’t quite eliminate the route; they replaced it with 15-minute frequency lines of equivalent service over the majority of its length… For most people (including me), this didn’t change the bus schedule at all, and it actually extended the number of stops that got 15-minute frequency. The route is of course no longer free though (at least in non-COVID times), which was a major blow to many. And someone wishing to take the bus from East Durham all the way to Duke would need to transfer at Durham Station.
IIRC, the city reasoned that the majority of riders used the route to transfer at the station anyway. They also blamed Duke for pulling funding, as the BCC had been subsidized by Duke since its inception as a way to encourage students to visit downtown. Duke opted to expand its network of private shuttles instead. I’m hopeful that fare-free buses might be in Durham’s future. Has Raleigh brought back fares, or is everything still free?
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That’s true, and I’d even argue what we have now is an upgrade since the BCC ran at an awkward 17min frequency. What I thought I implied better was that the bus service changes were also bad optics. It fed into the narrative that Durham’s leaders are heavily investing in economically booming areas at the cost of neighborhoods like East Durham and Hayti, even if that’s only partially true.
…and if the past few years of national politics taught us anything, it’s that facts and truth can get thrown out the window when blazing emotions are front and center. I don’t know about y’all, but that makes it obvious to me where the animosity against commuter rail is coming from. I think these people feel (not necessarily think) that their opposition of GTCR is a part of a proxy war against the powers-that-be. You need more than just facts to bring them over to your side.
I’m curious about fare-free buses, too, though it seemed controversial even in our community. Raleigh hasn’t brought back fares, either. All major transit agencies in our region -not just for Raleigh and Durham, but GoCary and GoTriangle too- have suspended their fares until at least June 30, 2022.
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Yeah, NS consistently gets the lowest grade on Amtrak’s “Host Railroad Report Card”
Note the “4-year GPA: 0.5 out of 4 = F”
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