My eyeroll was for your comment regarding the call to ban people that disagree with you. That is just counterproductive and stoooopid.
I am on the fence around the gondola. I think it could be great, for all the reasons you pointed out. It could also very well be a maintenance and operations nightmare, that the city will have to keep pouring money into if the ridership numbers are not there to support it.
I don’t know enough about gondolas to have a good feel for this. I know they are extensively used at ski resorts. But also that ski resorts ticket prices are crazy high.
A gondola wouldn’t be any sort of solution to transportation. Yes, people will use it to get from A to B whatever those points end up being IF this ends up happening, but they could have gotten from A to B more quickly. This isn’t about solving a transportation problem, it is in fact about implementing a cool and very recognizable feature to Raleigh that highlights the connection points and draws people that wouldn’t otherwise know Raleigh or otherwise wouldn’t come downtown. I don’t expect if you were to run numbers of revenue draw specifically around the gondola that it would pay for itself. I do expect if you were to run numbers of the combined attraction of things like Dix, RedHat Amp, the Convention Center, etc, etc with the gondola being an overarching (pun intended) glue to connect those things, we’re absolutely building something unique and good for city revenue.
I should have AI rewrite that but you get my point. Don’t look at this potential project as some form of functional transportation offsetting cars.
Fine, a rewritten ChatGPT5 version:
A gondola isn’t meant to be a pure transportation fix—there are faster ways to get from point A to point B. Sure, people will ride it if it’s built, but its real purpose is different. It’s about adding a distinctive, eye-catching feature to Raleigh that links our major destinations and gives people—especially those who might not otherwise visit downtown—a reason to come and explore.
On its own, the gondola might not generate enough revenue to “pay for itself.” But when you look at it as part of a bigger picture—connecting Dix Park, Red Hat Amphitheater, the Convention Center, and other downtown attractions—it becomes the unifying piece that makes the whole greater than the sum of its parts. That’s the kind of investment that strengthens Raleigh’s identity and boosts city revenue in the long run.
That wasn’t me to be clear. But I think their second paragraph was mostly sarcasm.
It’s good and bad that there aren’t more examples to learn from. Portland’s aerial tram is almost 20 years old and it didn’t go up without controversy, but it’s thriving, so I’d think we’d start by reaching out to them for lessons learned.
I mean, … maybe? That’s kinda unclear to me, too - which means @Roganberry should’ve made that clear.
I agree with @Kanatenah: a gondola would be a great tourist attraction, but it’s somewhere between stupid and actively harmful to ban people over it.
Anyways, let’s get back on topic:
As a tourist draw, I think a gondola makes sense. It’ll be a neat, iconic li’l thing that doesn’t seem unnecessarily out of the way of the Raleigh-visiting experience.
But I think the pushback you’re getting is also totally reasonable - mainly because the DRA’s messaging makes it sound like they’re trying to build a new transit option that’s competing against those future ground connections. If that is actually their main, intended pitch, then it doesn’t really make much sense as @John, @OakCityDylan et al. said. We should at least be honest about the why.
As for the “transportation” aspect of a gondola, and locals likely rarely using it: neither is the point. The point is specifically for visitors who are staying downtown to have a fun and interactive method of visiting Dix Park from downtown. That’d be it’s main function: literally just a tourist attraction - and that’s something Raleigh desperately needs more of.
Well said. The Eiffel Tower, Space Needle, Mt. Rushmore, Hollywood Sign, The Gateway Arch, the big Jesus statue etc don’t really have any value other than just being cool and iconic. This at least would serve a purpose. So many cool things you can do with this. You can hire local artists to paint the cable cars for example.
I was just in Austria skiing this past winter and they had a vertical bull-wheel gondola that loaded in this compact design I had never seen before. So this could be incorporated into the new convention center design.
It could be a reason to attract more foot traffic into the convention center to load up the gondola then get unloaded into one of the largest urban parks in the country. All without interrupting your walking ability during a visit downtown.
I’ve never been a fan of the gondola idea but I think it may be cool. Do I think it’ll be a big touristic draw, maybe, but the things that make a city lovable is not flashy expensive projects.
To take from the ideas mentioned from Happy City by Charles Montgomery, we need to create neighborhoods where people can watch and interact with other people. I believe the stroll-way, with its storytelling and art features will be successful with doing this (as most trails in dense areas do).
I believe that we should be building more history/art stroll-ways, downtown parks (pocket parks, community gardens, etc.), lake wheelers, and commerce plazas across downtown.
I don’t disagree with you about what makes a great neighborhood and downtown. But 1- we’re very much in the middle of creating those spaces all over DTR, it’s happening already, and 2- we still need something to differentiate Raleigh because we don’t have a tourist attraction. This whole conversation started because the city said they wanted a “bold connection.” We can have it all.
I’m just here to tell ya… nobody visits a new city to go to a neighborhood and watch and interact with other people lol - they visit a new city when there are things to do - this would simply just provide something to do that’s not just “go out to eat, drink, and shop” - it’s an actual activity (ride a gondola + enjoy high-up views of the surrounding city and landscape + explore a really cool, gigantic urban park… then shop, eat and drink while you’re there )
Tourists should never be the targeted audience, residents should be. “Needing” but really wanting to have some one grand whatever is cool but I believe the city should focus on creating multiple small-ish and influential third-places.
Examples: differently themed pocket parks located every other mile across downtown; create multiple grand plazas across downtown; create an emerald necklace (small connected parks) that connect every existing touristic destination via a MUP/trail… (public/private partnerships)
Unfortunately most people complain about walking 100 yards to park their car in a parking deck. Convincing someone or a family of 4 with strollers and crap to walk 3/4 of a mile to a park, that they will eventually have to walk back from, is a tough sell.
That’s more of a problem related to the ugliness of the street and area. There isn’t much in that area and it isn’t well shaded. It will most likely be more inviting after Heritage Park and the adjacent empty lot is redeveloped with retail and additional sidewalk trees.
People somehow enjoy walking all over Historic Oakwood or Fayetteville St. and Glenwood Ave. The reason why is because of the character of the street or neighborhood.
I’m pretty sure we need to target tourists better. Not just out of town tourists but local people who otherwise would go to Fenton or North Hills. People should really enjoy going downtown for multiple reasons and activities.
I am one hundred percent on board with acorn shaped cars! Those are awesome!
I am somewhat dubious about the whole sky-tram thing. I like the idea in theory, but practically . . . I think I come down on the improved walking trail.
It might even get so bad we’ll have to build a train or some sort of shuttle to ferry all these people around. Not to mention all the jobs we’ll have to create in the meantime.
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