Raleigh and Statistical Area Population

I also to add insult, they actually shrunk the Triangle CSA took out a few towns and I think a county lol

Those are updated numbers. #germaneffeciency

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One of the things that I like about the site that I linked is that they show density. At the MSA level, Raleigh’s MSA is easily the most densely populated, while the Triangle’s CSA is still a bit more dense than Charlotte’s.
Of course, that site is all in metric and it makes you do the math if you want to know the data based on square miles.

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Elsewhere in NC, Brunswick County belonging to the Myrtle Beach MSA/CSA (and not Wilmington) is a joke. The non-seasonal population of Brunswick is heavily skewed towards Leland/Southport/Oak Island and (I would imagine) commute patterns reflect that as well

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Difficult to calculate precisely, since most tract boundaries don’t yet line up with 540 (it’s too new). But you could approximate it by adding up the municipal populations inside, and subtracting the populations of tracts entirely outside 540; tract-level populations are available.

Sure is. The usual response to “OMG, that planning effort was way too tough & contentious” has been “OK, we’ll put it off even longer, and just keep piling on the stakes.”

But a better response would be to lower the stakes and update more frequently. As I keep reminding myself, a journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step

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I can see how this could be helpful in terms of stakeholder buy-in. But if you make them frequent enough that the “plans” fluidly change every time there’s some short-term political pressure, what’s the point of having plans in the first place?

I find this interesting:

MSN Money Talks News reports Raleigh metro is the second fastest growing metro after Austin between 2015 and 2020.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/realestate/the-15-fastest-growing-metro-areas-in-the-u-s/ss-AAQKhQb?ocid=msedgntp#image=15

Hilarious stat listed: " Most common origin for recent movers: Durham-Chapel Hill, NC" You could move across the street and be included in this report. lol

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I moved from Brier Creek at one point. That almost counts!

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Herein lies the only statistic advantage to Raleigh being split from Durham. The Raleigh side of the metro grows much faster than Durham-Chapel Hill, and including them would push down the growth rate and make Raleigh rank lower.

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I’ve moved to 9 different houses in Raleigh in my lifetime (5 as an adult). What has that done to the statistics?
:joy:

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Here is long post about statistical areas, which I am not going to attempt to condense. If you don’t know much about how metro areas are identified, defined, named, and changed, this might be interesting. If you already know the whole story you can probably skip it. I left out a bunch of political history going back into the mid 20th Century that helps explain why some metro areas continue to exist the way they do and why Micropolitan areas are even a thing, but while interesting (to me) that stuff isn’t super relevant to the Triangle. (Roanoke Rapids might like a word.)

First, metropolitan and micropolitan areas (Core-Based Statistical Areas, CBSA) are defined by starting from the shape and population of urban areas (and urban clusters). Urban areas meeting specific criteria can form the basis for a CBSA.

  • An urban area of at least 10k population can form a micropolitan area
  • An urban area of at least 50k can form a Metropolitan Area.

Current urban areas were defined after the 2010 census, based on a definition developed after the 2000 census (with minor modifications).

  • Greenville’s Urban Area has 117k people, and so it is tagged as the Central City of the Greenville Metropolitan Statistical Area (MSA).
  • Once a Central City is identified, the entire surrounding county is automatically included as part of the CBSA. Pitt County is thus automatically the Central County of the Greenville MSA.
  • Little Washington, down in Beaufort County, has an urban area with 16k people. Thus, Washington is the Central City of the Washington Micropolitan Statistical Area (μSA), and Beaufort is the Central County.

Once central counties are identified, county commuting patterns are analyzed. Any county where more than 25% of residents with jobs commute to an established Central County of any CBSA (metro or micro), that county is added to the new CBSA.

  • 26% of working residents of Greene County commute to Pitt. Thus Greene County is added to the Greenville MSA.
  • 16% of the workers in Beaufort County commute to Greenville MSA (Pitt and Greene counties combined), so Washington μSA is added to Greenville MSA to create a Combined Statistical Area (CSA), the Greenville-Washington CSA. (The threshold for a CSA is 10% commuting between individual CBSAs.)

So we identify central cities, then use commuting data to identify outlying counties. Once the CBSAs are defined, though, the list of which counties are included changes little from decade to decade, so you can pretty quickly get the new metro area populations as soon as new population estimates are released every year (generally in March).

Commuting patterns are published at approximately 5-year intervals as part of the 5-Year American Community Survey. (The ACS is released in 1-year and 5-year chunks, but a new 5-year chunk is released every year, covering different variables each year.) New commuting estimates can result in a wholescale revision of CBSA definitions, but they will always be based on the existing Urban Area definitions.

The last batch of commute data was released in 2017, based on 2011-2015 data. This is where, for example, Asheboro μSA was absorbed into Greensboro MSA, and where Greene County was added back to Greenville MSA after it had dropped from it in 2011 or so. Atlanta adds a new county every time the commute data updates; Lexington lately is absorbing one of its satellite μSAs at each interval. But Raleigh and Durham stay separated because our Urban Areas are separated, and neither Durham nor Wake sends 25% of commuters to the other county.

The next 5-Year ACS with commute data is due to release in 2022, but will probably be delayed until 2023 for a reason I’ll get to. So for the next couple of springs you can get new MSA populations every year, but they’ll based on old definitions. Fortunately, we’ll get new definitions soon.

The 2003 Urban Area definition was full of problems that were not apparent until after the 2010 census (or at least not clearly problematic). In a previous post in this chain I rambled about how bad the UAs are for North Carolina, and while I don’t expect anyone to remember that I won’t rehash it in detail. Suffice to say, Raleigh and Durham have separate UAs, but they share a long border together. Meanwhile, Gastonia and Concord both have separate UAs from Charlotte, but Charlotte’s UA extends all the way to Salisbury and Mooresville; Hickory, Morganton, and Lenoir are all combined as well, but Greensboro and High Point are separate. So there are problems with the whole UA definition, but defining the UAs is the limit of what the Census Bureau does concerning the MSA/μSA/CSA system.

The actual definition of metro areas has always been left up to the Office of Management and the Budget, a legacy of OMB’s need to organize Americans efficiently for the disbursal of federal funds. This has sometimes led to conflict with the Census Bureau’s mandate to define where and how Americans live and work. The Census Bureau may change how it defines urban areas, but the actual definition and naming of CBSAs remains a job for OMB; it is the OMB that examines the commuting data to assign outlying counties to Central Counties to create CBSAs.

We can debate whether OMB is a more explicitly political agency than the Census Bureau, but the opportunity for Congressional lobbying on the shape of CBSAs is baked into the process. Once the Census finishes the hard work of defining the exact shape of urban areas, they send the list of UAs to OMB. OMB then has the opportunity to send back revisions before official UAs and CBSAs are released by the two agencies. This back and forth is designed so that “local communities” can be “consulted” on the names and boundaries of potential UAs and CBSAs, at multiple steps in the process.

So, we can thank “community consultation” for the invisible line dividing Raleigh’s UA from Durham’s, and hence the existence of separate metro areas. The fix for this will thus likely require more community consultation: Raleigh needs to convince Durham to join forces. It almost certainly won’t happen merely on the basis of actual data (unless someone at OMB decides to ignore community input and aggravate a Congressman).

(The same is true for a number of other metro areas: Greenville and Spartanburg, Salt Lake City and Ogden, Washington and Baltimore, LA and Riverside, Trenton and both Philly and New York; sometimes these are rational decisions. Strict adherence to the UA definitions would absolutely lead to a single Urbanized Area running from Bridgeport CT to Fredericksburg VA, for example. After 2010, Delaware somehow allowed the former Wilmington MSA to be absorbed into Philadelphia without complaint, though nothing had changed in terms of density of development between the two. So there’s hope.

But some problems actually stem from the Census Urban Area definition. The definition starts by examing population density in census tracts, and combines together adjacent tracts with density over a certain threshhold. If enough tracts exist to reach 2500 people, they form an Urban Cluster. If the cluster grows to 50k population, it becomes an Urban Area. That’s simple enough, right? Oh, but many urban areas contain big chunks of territory like warehouse districts and suburban business parks that have no population, or at least little density, but which might connect to other urban areas further away. These should be included, right? And of course you have rivers and lakes, airport runways, all kinds of things that can break up an urban area that don’t meet the population density criterion but are part of a given urban area and maintain an urban character.

So the definition includes hops, skips, and jumps (literally, those are the terms), whereby two nearby urban areas can be connected across say an airport, a warehouse district, a state park, a river, or similar areas where people just can’t live but that exist inside a continuous urban region.

Unfortunately, the way the hops and skips were defined, a lot of urban areas ended up with bizarre tentacles running along highways, leading to things like Charlotte UA connecting all the way around Concord and up to Salisbury.

This is the only reason why Iredell and Rowan counties are part of Charlotte metro. When an Urbanized Area extends into multiple counties, the Census Bureau uses an algorithm to determine, based on the percentage of the population in that county that is within the UA, whether that county gets included as an additional Central County. So for Charlotte, of course Mecklenburg is a Central County, but because Salisbury is part of the Charlotte UA thanks to I-85, Rowan County gets lumped in as a Central County of the Charlotte MSA.

  • What’s especially aggravating about that is that, if the UA was more appropriately defined and Salisbury and Mooresville and Statesville were cut out, then, based on the commuting data, Rowan and Iredell would not be part of Charlotte MSA! They’d be separate MSAs, as they were prior to 2013. Sure, they’d be included in the CSA, but nobody ever looks at those (I mean, Durham and Raleigh are the same CSA and no one cares). Ironically, while Gastonia and Concord have separate UAs, both of those counties meet the 25% commuting requirement to be included in the Charlotte MSA, and so wouldn’t ever form their own CBSAs anyway.

  • And what’s more, if Iredell wasn’t included, then Lincoln County also wouldn’t be part of Charlotte MSA; it only gets to 25% commuters by adding Meck and Iredell together (along with Gaston and Cabarrus et al, but Iredell is actually the key county that pushes Lincoln over 25%).

  • So, if Charlotte’s UA was more rational, then even if Raleigh and Durham remained separate, Charlotte would be a notably smaller MSA, simply having numerous smaller CBSAs included in a grand CSA nobody would ever talk about.

  • But wait, there’s more! The Raleigh-Durham CSA happens to include several other outlying MSAs and μSAs, including Henderson (Vance Co) and Oxford (Granville Co). Well, if you merged Raleigh and Durham, the commute numbers for both Vance and Granville would be pushed over the 25% threshold, and those two counties would be included as part of the Raleigh-Durham MSA. Warren County, too, would be included; and what’s more, we’d steal Burlington MSA away from the Triad.

  • Bottom line: based on 2020 data, if Raleigh and Durham comprised a single UA and thus a single MSA, the actual metro area population would be 2,125,105. Meanwhile a more rational Charlotte MSA would have a population of only 2.3M without Rowan, Iredell, and Lincoln. MSA growth rates would be 19% for Charlotte and 21% for the Triangle. Just let that one roll around in your head for a little bit (We’d still be behind Nashville, though, but only by a tiny bit).

Now, all that could change when the new commute data drops, which as I said could be next December but will probably be Dec 2023. The potential delay is because the Census Bureau has rewritten its Urban Area definition. New UAs will be available in mid 2023, and I assume OMB will put off revising CBSAs until the new definition is in place.

The new definitions are designed to cut down on the sort of growth-by-highway glomming of distinct urban areas together, while still allowing an urban area to leap over big rivers and things. The more substantive change is philosophical, though: instead of looking at population density, the new definition uses density of structures and housing units. This supposedly reflects more what an urban area feels like; in trial runs comparing existing UAs to UAs under the new definition, most areas saw limited change in their core, but the tentacles were eliminated.

This means that after 2023 there will likely be a slight increase in CBSAs, such as Salisbury NC; but also a potential decrease in CBSAs where commute data reflects that some outlying smaller areas (like Oxford and Henderson) may be absorbed into bigger areas. And of course, we may lose some micropolitan areas altogether: another change to the urban area definitions will be the elimination of any urban areas with under 10k population. I don’t expect any NC micros to disappear (Roanoke Rapids’ UA was at 24k in 2010, so we can assume that even with 15% population loss they’ll be fine) but more than a few smaller ones (like Union City and Martin, TN) will almost certainly dip below 10k. The fate of these potential lost micros has not been addressed by the Census Bureau.

And this is all assuming we don’t get an extraordinary intercensal count in 2025, which remains a possibility.

Anyway, thanks for letting me geek out for a while here. Hope this was interesting to you and, if you actually read it, that you learned something new.

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Excellent and thank you!

Does anyone know how the “commuting patterns” are derived?
Would these include auto’s, Buses, BRT’s, CR, etc…?

It’s everything… mode of transportation isn’t at issue. The question is, which county do you go to work in? And which county do you live in? If a quarter of the people that live in county A go to work in county B, then A is going to be part of B’s metro.
There is lots of separate data collected on means of transportation–the census calls it Journey to Work. It’s fun to see where people drive vs where they…also drive. It is still America after all.

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Thanks for the deep dive! (Times like these, I wonder if some posts on this forum like yours could be turned into blog posts or news explainer articles on their own…) It’s especially interesting to see how highway-based tentacles can turn into a perverse incentive for smaller towns to lobby for highway construction at the cost of their own livability.

The part that’s more directly relevant to the Triangle, though, is:

So Raleigh is going to have to bite the bullet and open the doors for Durham to push for a regional identity in the eyes of the feds, huh? This sounds like a trend, since I noticed the same subtext popping up in the affordable housing and commuter rail threads, too.

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From what I remember many moons ago, it’s Durham that “community consulted” its way to a separate MSA. That ball isn’t in Raleigh’s court.
Now, I am nearly certain that Durham would agree to a single MSA if they got named first, but that isn’t going to happen.

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This is true. When Durham was under Mayor Bill Bell era, he was always pushing for Durham to step out of Raleigh’s shadow.

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If growth rates for the Raleigh MSA have continued in alignment with what they were in the recent past, then Raleigh’s MSA has likely already passed Oklahoma City to become the USA’s 41st largest MSA in the country. It’s likely 3+ years from now before we pass Milwaukee to become #40.

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We’re going to pass Milwaukee?! We’re going to pass Milwaukee?!

We’re gonna make it
Give us any chance we’ll take it
Read us any rule we’ll break it
We’re gonna make our dreams come true
Doing it our way
Nothings gonna turn us back now
Straight ahead and on the track now
We’re gonna make our dreams come true

Doing it our way
There is nothing we won’t try
Never heard the word impossible
This time there’s no stopping us
We’re gonna make it

On your mark, get set, and go now
Got a dream and we just know now
We’re gonna make our dreams come true
And we’ll do it our way yes our way

Make all our dreams come true
And we’ll do it our way, yes our way
Make all our dreams come true for me and you!

(Millennials and Gen Z, ask your parents or grandparents what the joke is here.)

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GenX here and I had to look that one up…

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