Not unless someone gets creative and mimics the Flatiron Building in NYC
8 Likes
That would be so awesome.
There is the outside possibility they could build over the tracks . . . but that would destroy @atl_transplant idea of linear park, which I do like a lot.
3 Likes
Looks like this will fill up the rest of their land. (Empire owns the next wedge over to the east between the tracks.)
2 Likes
I’m sure we could find a way to integrate the park space somehow. Would make for a nice creative space. Something needs to be done here though IMO. Once they close the Carrabus crossing, it’ll almost feel cut off from the rest of downtown. We really need something to bridge the gap.
2 Likes
What a shortsighted and dumb plan… I truly hope they anticipate building up on top of the parking deck expansion. Once this is all built, I feel like they’re going to have more parking than they do actual habitable building…
6 Likes
I think their entire Block 83 complex is literally about 50/50 commercial floor area vs parking deck floor area. That is certainly the case for this phase.
I wonder how this compares with other projects like 301 Hillsborough, Seaboard Station, etc?
2 Likes
This is honestly insane to me. I’m realizing that the Phase 3 tower is literally a parking deck pedestal with tower on top … and then ANOTHER parking deck attached to the parking pedestal. WTF???
1 Like
For planning purposes, 350 square feet per space is a good rule of thumb for less- optimal garages. Short-span parking structures generally can range between 360 and 400 square feet per parking space.
^from Google.
I plan office space at a metric that’s less than this per person.
1 Like
It’s a new parking deck next to an existing parking deck, next to a new parking pedestal with a building on top, which itself is kitty corner from another parking deck.
This is not what I meant when I was defending parking decks as a necessary evil… Lol
4 Likes
Should we rename the thread to Park_83?
4 Likes
“Decks 83” would do it I think.
10 Likes
Wow that seems huge! I’ve been thinking about adding a one-car garage to my house and have been doing research on how much space it would take up and many websites say 20x16. And that assumes you’ve got some additional space for storage, etc.
You have to account for circulation, not just storage… but yeah it’s definitely crazy how much space it takes up.
Their land… their project. If they feel they need an overabundance of parking to fill an 18 story office space, go for it. It’s essentially land that is currently sitting silent at the moment.
1 Like
So, there’s definitely that perspective. But we have to remember that if we build out our downtown and replace every parking lot or auto-repair shop with high rises that assume a 1:1 person:car ratio, carmageddon will result.
Vehicular capacity to access to Downtown Raleigh is limited compared to (say) Charlotte or Atlanta which have huge freeways. We’re limited to perhaps a dozen arterials in and out, since our city has no downtown freeway, a very small area with a proper urban grid, and rather disappointingly low density most everywhere that the grid does exist outside of downtown proper. So, downtown Raleigh can’t handle that many cars in/out every rush hour before the whole system starts to break down.
On the one hand, it’s good, because we don’t have a noose like 277 in Charlotte, or an awful 16 lane traffic sewer like the Downtown Connector in Atlanta, and it’s an opportunity for us to make transit an actual priority and a real workable alternative, and have a real, pleasant, walkable downtown, but…
…nobody has managed to connect those dots yet, so the 1:1 person:car ratio continues on, unabatedly careening us towards an eventual (painful) reckoning.
8 Likes
I’m not really sure how painful increased traffic is. However, the worse the traffic the more people seak alternative means of travel which is a good thing. A lot of downtown construction is residential and if there are others who, like me, leave the car parked and walk or bike everywhere downtown then that’s not adding so much traffic. It’s helping traffic. Most traffic is caused by building further and further out with people driving in to the city for work and entertainment. Higher density downtown will help to reduce traffic with population and employment growth remaining equal.
6 Likes
Well, right now, in Raleigh, for every 100 new jobs downtown, you probably get 90+ new single-occupancy car trips into downtown and for every 100 new downtown residents that are employed, you probably also get 90+ new single-occupancy car trips out of downtown.
Downtown just isn’t that big of a concentration of jobs or residents relative to the rest of the city or metro right now. You are right, though, every new apartment or office building probably nudges the percentage of people who both live and work downtown upwards, but we have a long way to go and we’re still at a place where adding jobs or residents adds traffic.
Now, I don’t mind traffic, honestly, for the sake of drivers’ convenience. They should expect traffic in a downtown area. The problem is that heavier car traffic creates more safety and pollution problems, and as congestion increases it creates friction against continued development - as does the simple cost of building heaps of parking with every development.
4 Likes
The bottom line is getting more people to walk or bike or take transit to work, etc. People moving here to distant suburbs causes the traffic because they have to drive everywhere. The only other option is to stop the growth which isn’t happening. By the way, Raleigh’s small footprint is one of its best assets. It feels like a small town and a city at the same time.
2 Likes
Parking maximums cannot come soon enough.
3 Likes
The Alexander Square parking deck on Fayetteville St. was built to hold up to 10 stories on top of it. The Power House parking deck on West St. was also built to support a building on top. Maybe the new deck will be built to support a tower on top of it as well?
3 Likes