Not true for me. I drive minimal. And if I drive it’s a very short distance. Like less than 3 miles max.
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I’ll start with Walmart and Target cater to America’s demand for one-stop shopping, but the dominance of big-box retail has contributed to societal issues such as rising health concerns, environmental degradation, and unsustainable consumer habits. The widespread availability of highly processed foods has fueled obesity and chronic diseases, while the prevalence of low-quality, disposable products reinforces wasteful consumption patterns. Additionally, the push for affordability often comes at the cost of ethical labor practices and sustainability, encouraging mass production at the expense of quality and long-term well-being. While these stores provide undeniable convenience, they also shape a culture that prioritizes immediacy over responsible consumption, deepening economic and environmental challenges.
People in urban areas tend to shop less frequently at big-box stores like Target and Walmart, as they typically own fewer possessions and dine out more often. This trend is particularly evident in cities like New York and other international metropolitan areas, where residents prioritize convenience, fresh food, and smaller living spaces that discourage bulk purchasing. Instead of filling a cart with 50+ pounds of groceries, city dwellers often make frequent but smaller shopping trips to local grocery stores. In New York, many residents swear by their neighborhood bodega, where they can pick up essentials like paper towels, drinks, and miscellaneous items—often alongside hot, prepared food.
The contrast in lifestyle is particularly striking between the most of the U.S. and Europe. In America, many families prefer the convenience of a drive-thru Starbucks, allowing them to buckle their children into car seats before running errands. Meanwhile, in Europe, daily routines often include leisurely neighborhood strolls, stopping at a local coffee shop, picking up fresh bread, and visiting retail establishments for shopping. This approach fosters a more social and pedestrian-friendly culture.
Additionally, modern delivery services help mitigate transportation logistics, making it even easier for urban dwellers to access goods and bulky purchases without needing a vehicle.
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outside of some commutes car light/car free is likely difficult. i can say when i lived just off falls of the neuse near spring forest road(early mid 80s development), it was super easy to not hop in a car to eat, get groceries, play tennis, hair cut…abc store even. i know there was a portion of the sidewalk that was wider than normal specs that i thought was purposely done as mild mixed-use path-age. there are a number pockets of older devel out of DTR are not bad to walk or bike
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true…with an ebike and two baskets and maybe a backpack from my place in roanoke i can make a store run in equal time as my car and get in a bit of excercise. 30lbs of groceries at max usually. does downtown have an ebike dealer of any kind?
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We do and it’s right across from Publix (Electric Speed Shop). We bought ours there.
I suppose our family may fall I to the ‘wealthy’ category (though we are still working class, just with a tech salary). Nevertheless I’ll say we’ve found it very doable to reduce to around 5 car trips per week with a 2 year old. My wife takes him to Marbles on the bike.
I dread the car seat to be honest. It’s such a pain to load and unload the kid at every single errand stop. If this is the ideal lifestyle it ain’t for me.
Meanwhile we’re just wrapping up a vacation in France where we went to 3 different cities and only touched a car once. What a delight to just walk him straight onto a bus or metro. He loves riding them, too.
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Distance isn’t the only factor for walkability either. Obviously, this group has talked about ample sidewalks and such but another factor that’s sometimes overlooked is Topography. Neighborhoods on downtown’s edge aren’t exactly all flat. When I lived in Mordecai, I was–on paper–only a ten minute walk to all the restaurants and shops in the North Person and Seaboard areas. However, it was all up hill. So it always was 15-20. If it was over 75 degrees outside, I’d be covered in sweat, which I’m sure some fellow restaurant goers wouldn’t care to sit near. 
So, yeah, guess what? My ex and I would often drive—even that short of a distance. 
(And I briefly lived near Boylan Heights in the early 00s and that was a similar issue there.)
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The good thing is that it’s all down hill on the way back.
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Nope. Uphill both ways
(Couldn’t resist)
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Going to repeat this: the Raleigh area is consistently #1 in the country on vehicle miles traveled per adult. As of spring 2024, based on phone tracking data:
Raleigh 42.7
Houston 33… Raleigh is 29% higher
Los Angeles 27.4… Raleigh is 56% higher
NYC 16.4… Raleigh is 160% higher
So a median Raleigh-area resident drives 2.6X as many miles per day as a median NYC-area resident!
Here’s a (low-resolution) national map at the Census tract level. ITB Raleigh has about the same VMT as, say, Fairfax County VA – which is mostly outside the Beltway. There’s hardly any low-VMT urban core in Raleigh.
Yes, it’s progress, but it’s a mixed bag because it’s because sprawl production dropped a lot, housing production declined overall, and as a result housing prices increased. Housing production in more-urban areas has maintained its pace nationwide. To maintain overall housing production, and therefore to keep prices down, will require lots more supply – and particularly in urban areas rather than sprawl.
“during the 2010s construction rates in the Sun Belt fell toward levels long-experienced by supply-constrained coastal markets… Consequently, Sun Belt affordability declined.”
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Yorkville in Manhattan is often cited as the neighborhood with the highest population density in the United States, reaching over 156,000 inhabitants per square mile…warning, AI response. raleighs densest is maybe 6k psm, and a smaller tract of area? is it that odd that Raleigh would have much greater vehicle miles driven?
Eric Kronberg, a respected urbanist architect, recently shared the following visual:
Many people move into low-density neighborhoods and later become frustrated when rising taxes lead to cuts in public services, something they didn’t anticipate. That said, even in high-density, high-tax areas, poor governance or careless voting can still result in mismanaged services and public dissatisfaction.
Just like in construction, you can either have cheap, fast, or quality. The same applies to communities and their density.
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Of course, there are suburban municipalities of substantial size that find the “high taxes” overlap between “stable services” and “low density” quite acceptable because most residents in those cities are just wealthy. The average house value is high, so a comparatively modest tax rate still generates a lot of tax revenue. Johns Creek in metro Atlanta, for example, which is newer than Cary and has about the same population. This type of municipality have been around for a long time – suburban NY, suburban Boston, suburban Chicago, etc – and many of them have sustained themselves for decades and show no signs of decline.
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Makes sense in theory. Cost of utility infra for equivalently dense plots of land in high and low value neighborhoods is likely not scaling along with income.
So rich people pay acceptable (to them) tax rates, drawing high revenue (because they’re rich) and paying for better services. Since ‘low taxes’ is a subjective term, they get the middle spot.
So the solution to density is be rich.
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Yes, it’s possible to have low-density development with stable public services as shown in the image, but as you mention it comes at the cost of high property taxes, which only works for a small, affluent segment of the population. I grew up in a commuter town in New Jersey just outside NYC that fits this model. Property taxes there start around $8,000 for modest homes assessed at $400,000 (but selling/valued for closer to $650,000). Larger homes assessed at $1.3M but worth around $2M pay about $30,000 annually. Some properties valued over $4M have tax bills exceeding $75,000 per year.
Compare that to Raleigh, where a $5.5M home in North Hills has an annual property tax bill of just $39,000.
These low-density, high-service areas are typically have just a few older, smaller starter homes, not new builds, and have very high area median incomes (over $200,000). They’re undeniably pleasant places to live, and it’s easy to see why people want to replicate them.
But the reality is that most Americans can’t afford to live in such places. Yet many developers and residents try to recreate these environments—expecting stable services and low taxes. As I’ve pointed out before, that’s mathematically impossible. What happens in communities that want low taxes and neighbors take active steps to keep taxes low start to see service cuts and deferred maintenance.
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Coincidentally, there’s no more loose-leaf pickup by City of Raleigh.
https://www.newsobserver.com/news/local/counties/wake-county/article307794675.html
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9 posts were merged into an existing topic: Municipal Services and Safety in DTR
With all due respect, if I wanted to live like they do in Europe, I’d move there. LOL
I mean i just think the proposed backpacks and carts for food are great for a single person or can obviously work for a young couple without kids who wants their shopping to be some sort of an ideology, but for the vast majority of us in the triangle, families with kids, none of the suggestions are very practical.
All I was doing was observing how most of us live, but what I got was an RFK-Jr.-screed going on about red dye #40 and strolling thru European markets for fresh bread LOL. just kidding of course but YIKES.
Most of us just out here trying to make ends meet and feed the family. I mean you do you, what works for you but I read all that and thought
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I can respect small-c conservative stances, but you gotta make a better case than that! Rubs me the wrong way to take a purely ideological stance “that’s not how we do it round here” and accuse everyone else of ideological thinking.
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From your response, it seems you’re following a way of living that, while familiar and convenient, may not be the healthiest or most efficient approach. That’s where the core issue lies—and where meaningful change is needed. I get that change can be uncomfortable and difficult; it’s natural to resist it. But we live in a world that’s always shifting, and adapting is often necessary for growth. It’s also worth recognizing that societal norms and influences, often shaped by special interests, don’t always serve your best interests.
Like you said, many people just want to make ends meet and feed their families - that’s completely reasonable and should be attainable for everyone. But it’s easy to get caught up in consumerism and the influence of marketing, which often steer people into unnecessary challenges and unsustainable habits.
You say “ain’t nobody got time for that,” and I get that’s a common feeling when life feels stretched thin. But the truth is, it is possible to live in a way that supports both well-being and sustainability. In many modern, developed societies, people are able to earn a living wage, spend quality time with their families, enjoy leisure, eat fresh, tasty, and healthy food, and still maintain a fulfilling lifestyle. This isn’t some utopian ideal, it’s a proven, functioning reality in many parts of the world.
What makes this feel so out of reach for many Americans is that it goes against powerful systems and industries that profit from the opposite. The “American way,” as it’s often sold, is built around overwork, convenience, consumption, and profit. Endless work hours, long commutes, a constant push to buy more, ultra-processed foods all serve corporate interests - not personal or community well-being.
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…are you sure you’re a developer, because you sound WAYYY too grounded and ethical 
Just messing of course!
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