Hadn’t really thought of this before now, but if they go center-running along this stretch of Western, then I think a tunnel with steps up to the platform in the center would actually go a long way in driving ridership. Western is not a fun road to cross on foot. Of course, then you’d also need an elevator… and suddenly you’re trying to get NCDOT to cough up even more money.
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With the center running BRT on western, we’re likely to have a center refuge island.
Not perfect but it will make crossing on foot much easier and friendlier. Instead of crossing 7 lanes non-stop, you’d cross 1 side, have an island in the middle, then cross the other side.
A center stop connected to a ped bridge or tunnel would be some next level stuff though and amazing to see.
Imo, it’s much easier to implement a ped bridge here because you could theoretically have it come in 1 piece. The tie-ins are harder due to grades but practicality wise, it’s easier than getting in a culvert and since it’s a college campus it offers the chance for a dramatic statement bridge.
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Late to the game here, but I’d be careful in looking to Austin as a role model. They’re having some seriously sprawl-induced growing pains, and a lot of it can probably be blamed on TxDOT. For example, while Project Connect is going to end up being a huge win for the city and finally bring rail service through downtown, TxDOT is still planning to widen I-35, which will ultimately disincentivize mode shift despite the new light rail lines. On top of that, their one existing commuter line, the Red Line, has minimal TOD and currently terminates on the edge of downtown instead of running through it.
Additionally, Austin is quickly becoming one of the least affordable cities in the US, and a lot of that can be attributed to the region prioritizing car-centric sprawl over denser development. The city seems to be working to change some of these things, but TxDOT isn’t making it easy for them. Texans love to drive.
This is the closest I’m ever going to sound to a NIMBY, but not all growth is smart growth. Growth that isn’t thoughtful and well-managed will come back to bite you in the tail. We are growing, we have to grow, but we’ll end up with a congested, carbon-intensive mess if we aren’t careful about how we grow and what projects we choose to champion.
TL;DR: a growing city is not necessarily a sustainable city, and cities that aren’t sustainable are setting themselves up to fail. We may not be growing as fast as Austin or Nashville, but that gives us an opportunity to avoid their past mistakes and grow into a place that’s actually still desirable when I’m dead and gone.
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Yeah, it’s definitely wishful thinking, but it’d be cool to see. And you’re right, that crossing gets a lot easier when the route is center-running, so it wouldn’t be too bad anyway.
As for the bridge, agree that it’d be a great opportunity for an architectural statement (I’m imagining Wolfpack Red lights shining on a white arch or something like that), but I do wonder how long those ramps would need to be. Western is the highest point on that cross-section, if I recall correctly. So if you’re coming up Morrill toward Western, a bridge would make for even more climbing on your part, whereas a tunnel would reduce your climb from what is there currently.
But yeah, a ped bridge would definitely be a) more visually appealing, b) cheaper, and c) less disruptive during construction.
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You might have a heck of a view from up there.
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Well I think every city will have that, even we will nothing to do them.
You mentioned TXDOT that’s the state not them, most state capitals like us and them well always have to deal with the state.
The affordability is a problem every city will have, including us. But there affordable housing plan there seems great and adjustable.
Bottom line Austin is a great model to copy from, Austin is fine they have almost everything and approach we did they’re no excuses!
Also you mentioned Red Line that will be expanded past Downtown and follow i think the green line or blue line. Or meet them somewhere.
I believe that the city is doing a good job so far with introducing safer bike infrastructure across the city. However, I believe that our leaders need to do more.
This is a great example of safe bike infrastructure, that the city should use as a guide moving forward:
In order for the city to combat climate change, our leaders need to encourage more citizens to walk or bike by supporting people-friendly infrastructure and creating car-less streets or public squares. Staring with Fayetteville street.
If nothing else, the city needs to have time limits (ex: 6am-3pm) for car travel on certain streets like Glenwood Ave and Fayetteville Street to limit car emissions.
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I was wandering downtown today and did some brainstorming about Fayetteville Street.
I think it should go back to “mall” but maybe more of a hybrid / mix model.
Essentially we have 100’ of ROW building to building. Room for wide 15’ tree lined sidewalks with bump outs for outdoor dining etc. Then a 12’ meandering multi use path and 12’ emergency use path adjacent to it with retractable bollards. Those two parts combined still give a 22’ corridor for parades etc. The rest could be alternating sides of street vendors / pop up shops etc.
As for Glenwood, as I’ve said before, close it completely from Friday night thru midnight Monday. Pop up shops, farmers markets etc every weekend from Jones up to Johnson.
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I’m not against making Fayetteville a pedestrian only street, but it would not be my priority.
- Sidewalks are already decently big
- Traffic moves quite slow down Fayetteville St. and the stretch is flat.
- The street already closes during events so it’s not hard to close off during events which is mainly the only time it is busy outside of office lunch hours.
- The main thing that’s missing on Fayetteville St. is shops (at least on the South End).
I haven’t felt unsafe biking on Fayetteville St. I would avoid biking on Dawson and McDowell due to the higher car speeds.
What would be a major priority for me is making the sidewalks bigger on Glenwood South and closing it on Friday/Sat nights (with potential Saturdays all day as well). The sidewalks may bring the construction mess, but closing the street shouldn’t take too much.
I completely agree with introducing safer bike infrastructure. I’m kind of annoyed by how much the greenway is missing completion in some areas.
For example:
There’s a lot of apartments/condos near Crabtree Creek Trail and Mellowfield Dr. The “trail” here shown in Google Maps is unpaved and can get really muddy which prevents people from using it. It doesn’t help that the trail also gets really flooded here as well. The distance from the path to the parking lot is about 400 ft in the section shown on Google Maps. It would be about the same footage if they extended a connection from the end of Six Forks Rd to the trail.
Also near this area, the greenway trail has an unpaved path to Industrial Drive which can then be used to get to Wegman’s and surrounding shops. Since it is also unpaved it is not a good connection in wet weather. Approximate distance of unpaved trail is about 350 ft.
Left: Unpaved trail to condos.
Right: Flooded Trail in this section
Photo of the unpaved section to Industrial Drive.
On a different “wish list”, I would love for the city to capitalize on the dirt path from Nancy Ann Dr to the Art Museum park (200 ft). I’ve used this path a couple of times to get some food from Guasaca/Just Salad and then take it to enjoy it at the park.
Left: Looking towards the Museum of Art Park
Right: Looking from the Museum of Art Park to Nancy Ann Dr
Since I mentioned the Museum of Art Park, I would also like to highlight adding bike lanes or slowing traffic on Lake Boone Trail. Going downhill may not be so bad (heading East), but travelling west (uphill) on a sharrow is a bit more risky. There’s over 1000 residential units in this area and adding the bike infrastructure would give people the confidence to ride to Food Lion and surrounding shops. It would also give people a way to bike to the Museum of Art park instead of driving. Residents of this area would also be able to bike to get to the medical offices (for regular appointments).
I know there are other areas that have high residential counts that would benefit from bike infrastructure. I mentioned Lake Boone because I do bike near the area a bit (but never actually on Lake Boone Trail).
I will give the city props on the Blue Ridge Rd expansion. They do have plans to add bike lanes to Blue Ridge Road. Once that’s completed, I will be able to get to Food Lion in under 20 minutes biking. I currently avoid Blue Ridge.
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I think it plays into the idea that it’s Not A Bus so people might be more compelled to use it than waiting for Wolfline. And as it is, Wolfline seems to have issues being fully utilized since Transdev loaned some of Wolfline’s buses to Fairfax Connector in Northern Virginia.
In contrast, Duke is running rapid transit headways on the C1 between their two campuses, often having articulated buses to boot. That Wolfline hasn’t gone that far says a ton about Wolfline though going in house might expand their options.
Agreed that the city should shut down vehicular traffic on Glenwood south at certain times, at the very least Friday and Saturday evening/ nights. Retractable bollards make sense.
Also agreed that the Sidewalks on Glenwood need to be expanded.
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The Canes’ beat writer for The Athletic has weighed in. https://twitter.com/SaraCivian/status/1498468563581087751?s=20&t=zESuQkxXZigkO3mdiyzfsA
Comments touch on the usual suspects: walkability, transit, density, affordability.
Just the opinion of one person, and Sara is known to stir the pot from time to time, but a notable person at that with 70.2k followers has led to quite the debate in the comments. Wade into it if you dare.
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“Please leave and [take] some more northerners with you.”
Gross. Absolutely hate how prevalent this mentality still is here.
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If all Northerners leave Raleigh, there will be maybe 17 people left downtown 
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Yep, don’t threaten us with a good time. Who do you think is responsible for your home value skyrocketing?
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Meh. That’s just a rant. It’s not helpful and a bit immature. If she has a helpful thought or something constructive, then let us know please.
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I think it’s at least nice to see that there are people outside of this forum who want raleigh to become more “like a city” and not your typical “we want raleigh to be how it was in the 70s”
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Yeah, I’m with you on this. It was an unhelpful and immature comment, but there are a ton of responses talking about public transit and walkability. So, obnoxious as the approach may have been, it’s generating good conversation.
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Let me guess…she doesn’t live downtown or in a walkable area.
Of course, I have zero idea whether that’s true or not, but still…
I do have to “laugh” at all the times that I hear people complain about downtown, do nothing about it, and either live in the burbs and/or never visit downtown businesses to support what’s happening. #byefelicia
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