All this conspiracy about shutting down the DMV to suppress voting is very amusing. First of all plans to shut down the DMV office has been ongoing for years. The VOTER ID amendment has just passed and in reality nobody knew if it would pass or not. Then you must also presume many people are actually without an ID of some sort and that they will not be easily provided with the opportunity to get a voting ID. 34 states have some sort of Voter ID law in place (some of them in very liberal states). North Carolina will become the 35th. So I am guessing some of you must feel that every state who has such a law must be for voter suppression and that the majority of voters in North Carolina must also be for voter suppression. That’s a whole lot of people who by your views are just terrible terrible people…
well removing that prevents peoples easy access to license plates
Man, this thread took a turn.
I might point out that Five Horizons has no fewer than 3 planned developments within a few blocks of this property, in addition to the mostly (?) complete 10 Arros, and if it were to come up for sale, I imagine they’d be first in line. I wouldn’t be surprised if they propose a shorter version of the S. Saunders development.
Do you mean a scaled back version of S. Saunders or shorter as in not as high buildings? Why would they do that based on something the whole way on the other side of downtown? I’m not sure I follow your train of thought on this.
Good question, I meant conceptually. S. Saunders is a new urban cluster/destination that is being plopped down in a somewhat suburban, largely residential area. It is built on an urban scale (meaning it is pedestrian-oriented) and it will give the area a new focus. Fuller Heights is far enough away from DT proper that people (I assume) don’t typically walk there, but the Five Horizons will be a pedestrian magnet.
Someone will eventually create the same thing on New Bern Ave. but it won’t have 10 or 20 story towers. It will probably be on a larger scale than is traditional (so maybe 4-6 stories rather than 10-20) but it will signal the emergence of a new mini downtown area. The first development would probably spur the growth of copycat developments in the area. (BTW, the DMV property is already zoned for 4 stories).
IDK, I could also be totally wrong. How do you feel about it?
The one issue with Fuller Heights to downtown is the death trap that is Lake Wheeler and a lot of roads in Fuller Heights don’t connect. So I imagine it’s a real pain getting to downtown via foot; I know it’s a pain getting from my house south of Boylan to Trophy Maywood. Having said that I’m hoping the S. Saunders project along with Dix and projects like Caraleigh Mills on Maywood as well show the city there is a need to improve the pedestrian connections to the south.
The whole S. Saunders development seems kind of odd to me from the stand point of Five Horizons doing it. This is their first project they’ve done like this, I believe, which why I wondered if they were working with a silent partner or potential future tenant. Just seems like a really different direction from what they’ve done in the past…maybe that’s a natural evolution for a development company idk.
S. Saunders just seems like such a large departure for them I couldn’t envision them biting off another project of that size which is why when you said it I found it kind of intriguing.
Having said all of that I would hope that such a development would be envisioned for the DMV site as well by whoever controls the property going forward. I think S. Saunders is going to pull DTR further to the south and a project of similar size and vision could help do the same thing to the east along New Bern. Once a development like S.Saunders is in place I can see lots of growth taking place around it.
Well, you make good points about Five Horizon but I think the state will probably hold on to the DMV for a lot longer than we expect, since they don’t move quickly to sell surplus property. Assuming S Saunders goes well, and Five Horizon continues to make smaller projects near New Bern, I could see them being a prime bidder for this site. Obviously, I didn’t put all that context behind my original post.
Regarding S Saunders to DT. The heart of Fuller Heights is about a mile from DT proper and it’ll be a while before that’s a popular walking route. Even once it’s built out, a lot of people will consider it too far to walk. But S Saunders and related development could create a new destination. Most city neighborhoods have smaller commercial districts that could be considered the neighborhood “downtown” that can be reached on foot from surrounding houses. I’m hoping that’s what S. Saunders is for Fuller et al and DMV could be for that part of east Raleigh.
Also, I find it interesting, and I don’t mean this critically, the way you conceptualize these develoments as “pulling downtown” in a particular direction while I see them as essentially separate entities that will be distinct neighborhood centers. We’re talking about the same thing but we visualize them differently. It’s one of those funny human brain things. I think I’ll always consider anything east of Person or south of MLK to be outside of DT. Not that my opinion has any relevance, I just think it’s neat how we see things differently.
My bad…you’re correct. Still fishy.
My thinking is that 10-15 years from now what we think of as Downtown will be much different maybe more like Core Raleigh then it’s made up of all the various neighborhoods. Maybe like a Downtown - downtown distinction.
I consider where I live downtown as I’m able to walk to everything from Yellowdog to Trophy Maywood but I still get that for now I live outside of Downtown proper.
New Five Horizons project coming to Hargett St and Woodsborough Place, across from City Historical , called Phase 2 of Hargett Oaks subdivision. Most of the lots there are currently vacant. They are requesting a text change to current zoning. The neighborhood meeting is Dec. 17 at the Chavis Community Center at 6pm.
Going from planned townhouses (from back in the 90’s) to free standing houses now, I think, was the last I heard…? That’s my 'hood.
I know someone who owns one of those Woodsborough townhouses. They’re just renting it out waiting for the day someone comes to buy/knock it down.
Five Horizons is working to undo a strange ordinance that would have forced them to have vinyl siding and a few other things I believe. They want to do a little higher quality, like hardiplank, hence the text change.
I was told also that they are going to take over the HOA of the new homes and the existing townhomes and kind of “restore” it. That might help maintain the townhomes there rather than having them get knocked down.
I talked with Five Horizons’ attorney and he confirmed that’s what they are doing and that they will build 12 single family houses on the vacant lots there.
Any idea if that ordinance was meant to ensure better quality and durability at that time? Vinyl siding being being considered better for its low maintenance vs hoping residents in a lower income area can afford to paint their place…? To be clear, hardiplank really isn’t any better, people just think it looks better because it looks more like wood. It’s also not an oil company product for what that’s worth.
Five Horizons has now submitted plans for another all 1 bedroom condo development.
https://www.raleighnc.gov/content/PlanDev/Documents/DevServ/DevPlans/Reviews/2019/SiteReview%20/SR-001-19.pdf
This now brings them to 4 total plans submitted that look almost identical.
801 New Bern Ave.
310 North State St.
625 New Bern Ave.
908 New Bern. Ave.
Not sure how eager they are to actually break ground considering the first was submitted back in June 18
Also a shame to loose one of the few houses that size on New Bern in good shape.
This could be an interesting candidate to be moved to another lot…
At 3 floors, each with a roof top terrace (BTW, very nice), I find it hard to believe that these are one bedroom units. In the submittal, 20 is listed between the 1BR and 2BR on the form. I have to wonder if they presumed that their number went in front of the number of bedrooms, not after it?
As bizarre as it seems, that is the case for all 4 developments, all 1 bedroom according to the plans submitted.