City appears to be consistently mounting “No Right On Red” signs on posts located in the far right corner of each intersection. That policy does provide drivers with a reliable place to check.
However there are some intersections that may benefit from a second sign installed on the overhead mast arm due to size of the intersection (Wilmington/MLK) or unconventional intersection geometry.
I can understand a reluctance to do so as it could confuse uninformed drivers as to where to look for them.
It’s clear that you can’t just put up signs and expect behavior to change that much. Signs are equivalent to painted bike lanes with expectations that all of society will follow the rules. (Only a small amount do) I hope we can get to a place where we can alter the public realm to slow cars down and increase pedestrian safety.
I live downtown, so I am frequently walking and driving downtown. I was shocked that the Boylan / Hillsborough intersection wasn’t originally no right on red. I think even if it weren’t in the original area, the sight distance from turning off Boylan northbound to Hillsborough eastbound is bad enough to warrant the sign. You have to get way out into the crosswalk in order to see clearly. As such, I never did it even before the sign there went up. Glad it’s there now.
As to the mounting position, my guess is the city just did the cheapest and easiest thing without much regard to the end result. Easier to put in a sign and a post, or a sign halfway up the existing signal pole than to close a lane of traffic and get guys out on lifts to mount signs. I have found they are definitely not in the most visible locations.
I also noticed the one at Peace and Harrington streets recently got removed. Not sure why. I noticed traffic would back up pretty far on Harrington when people obeyed it, so maybe that. I would rather they play with the signal timing than remove the sign, but I’m no traffic engineer.
The No Right On Red sign at the corner of New Bern at Trawick is actually lit up in LED lights. (I think there’s a few other places in the city with them.) Granted it’s only turned on when the pedestrian hits the crosswalk button, but as a frequent driver there I’ll tell ya it does get driver attention significantly more than just a regular metal sign.
I’m sure they’re not cheap but at certain places it could be worth lobbying the city to install—- the number of distracted drivers in the Glenwood South area seems to be a good place to consider the benefits.
Interesting. So is the law always no right on red, and the a pedestrian just reminds the driver of this when they hit the button - or is it only the law when the light is on?
At that intersection, you can turn right if it’s not lit. But there’s no reason it can’t be programmed for downtown to be turned On whenever the light is red.
Reading down through this (@John, of course glad to hear you are ok and sorry you had to deal with some of the worse of America) I wanted to suggest this as well. What is the expectation of compliance when a sign, meant to adjust behavior for a red light, is mounted WELL away from the red light? You have to assume someone is not local and doesn’t know the town or local laws. If I’m in a foreign town and trying to navigate around, it’s nearly impossible to digest all of the signs. I’m far from defending drivers, but suggesting we need to cater to that scenario and if we do, the rest should be covered, then the excuse is just that the person isn’t paying attention.
Mount the No Right on Red NEXT TO THE RED LIGHT!
Ok, I’m settling down and thank you @Jake for lending me the ALL CAPS feature.
Yup. People that approach intersections are looking at the light. They seldom look at other things. Legally, they’re required to obey signs, but pragmatically, they might not see them since it’s not the usual place for them.
Typically, when I see a car doing what he’s doing on a one-way road, I’ll go behind their car. Of course, do not do this on a two-way road (like this one) because you don’t want to pop up from behind a car while someone is turning at the light.
From an earlier post, I mentioned that the no turn on red sign should be mounted exactly as you suggest next to the signal itself. This is absolutely where they should be mounted, and it’s how it’s done at Boylan & Peace by my condo.
One can follow all the standardized guidance that one wants, but if folks don’t see the signs they are for naught.
Expecting people to know you can’t turn right on red without any reasonable signage is kindof crazy… if you aren’t local you’d have absolutely no way of knowing
Was in Raleigh earlier this week, for the first time since January. Can’t remember if the no turn on red had already been implemented at that point. My car has some issues so I brought my motorcycle (sportbike), and I didn’t have any issues noticing any no turn on red signs, although it’s hard to “zone out” on the bike as it is a pretty aggressive and hardcore machine. I think for the average driver that is used to their car doing everything for them, it would be very easy to miss a no turn on red sign that wasn’t obviously hanging next to the stoplights, and even then people will still either fail to notice or completely disregard the no turn on red. I don’t see much upside to installing no turn on red signs anywhere except next to the stoplights, as that is where drivers will expect to see them.
Running north on Person this afternoon, someone turned right on red onto Franklin against the light, the sign is mounted right next to the light. Guy on his bike on the sidewalk in front of The Station. Innumerable jaywalkers.
Mostly, it’s that people just don’t care.
We need to bury some power lines and widen some sidewalks!
We also have to add some sidewalks where they don’t currently exist!
could some new type of red light lens be designed with a large X the word NO in it be cheaply inegrated?