Ha! Drunktown is back!
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Raleigh-Car(y)eaā¦! 
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Remember the good old days when Glenwood South only had this one drunk guy? Now itās filled with drunksā¦ #sad
Oh thatās so drunking sad.
Why are crime stats in downtown not weighed by the increase in people living or visiting downtown. I would assume if downtown had 10,000 residents and now thereās 20,000, all things being equal crime reported will double but really crime rates are flat per capita.
Because this is ridiculousā100% increase in murders because it went from 0 in 2022 to 1 in 2023.
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Thatās true but the space hasnāt doubled, so itās still x% more incidents in the same area. Like if 20 people got assaulted outside my store in 2021, but 25 got assaulted in 2022, thatās still an increase that I want dealt with.
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Why is there no mention that gun shootings on Glenwood South are down 100% from the week before? I agree with you. Numbers can be changed and give different perspectives. Per population should definitely be a big thing, at the same time visitors should also be taken into account.
This is intentionally deceptive.
Letās see the actual change from 2019 before this stupid experiment started.
Itās just Statistical data, not crime rates. Maybe the crime rate is the same but thereās no disputing that Glenwood South has been more dangerous in 2023 than it was in years past.
I think the bigger problem is that the folks that are selling drugs and illegally carrying concealed are not even going into the bars/clubs but rather just loitering on the streets. I donāt know how much metal detectors for the clubs would even help. We have to figure out a way to discourage these people from even coming to this area. Easier said than done.
My fear is that businesses and residents will start moving away slowly and then most of these business will end up shuttering because they donāt want to be the last one standing in an area thatās going downhill. This could end really bad if they donāt get it under control in a hurry.
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This is ultimately my concern as well. I know the areas and times to avoid downtown, but I fear for the āimageā of downtown to a lot of people. I donāt want this to be the late 70s to early 90s for downtowns again, where the people who can afford to avoid them. The one difference (for now) is that we have a lot of decently paid people actively moving to downtown. Maybe my concern then is that the high quality places will slowly leave for greener pastures (the fake downtowns as people here think of them: RIW, Fenton, LaFayette Village, North Hills, etc.), and the businesses left will be crappy bars and 711s.
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To all the crime apologists, and to those who want to sacrifice the cityās most viable walkable community to a weekly Spring Break instead of building a more comprehensive walkable city, go on ahead and keep apologizing and see what happens.
I agree with @Bobbycox and @GucciLittlePig regarding their concerns about businesses walking away from the neighborhood, but Iāll add to that the businesses who will choose not to come to the neighborhood in the first place.
As someone who lives this neighborhood during the days, nights weekdays and weekends for 2 decades now, it has not become what they city wanted it to be. The city wanted a vibrant 18 hour community, while they ended up with an overcrowded, late night, weekend party scene. Itās not difficult to understand why drug dealers hang out then because itās like shooting fish in a barrel for customers.
The problem is that the neighborhood is imbalanced vis-a-vis its goal of being an 18 hour community. Examples of this are all of the late night bars that are completely closed during the day. They take up prime real estate and contribute nothing during daylight hours and very little during evenings that arenāt Friday or Saturday. They prevent the district from having active sidewalks during the day and provide nothing of use to those in the walkshed during the day when the Sun is up. Itās a damn shame really because this is the very same part of the city that has the greatest potential to be the very walkable, 18 hour community that the city says it wants to have.
Ironically, the neighborhood āworksā best for the partiers who often donāt live in it, and who drive their cars and clog it up weekend after weekend after weekend: residents and non-party business owners be damned.
The city has completely blown its best opportunity to create the walkable 18 hour neighborhood that council has long said it wanted. The work toward that goal doesnāt stop with landing a grocery store and housing. Throwing lighting and policing at it arenāt the answers. Those actions arenāt going to bring daytime sidewalk activity and businesses to the neighborhood.
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What should the city do? Canāt pick which businesses come, I assume they incentivized residential in the area and thereās now more people than ever located there.
Thatās what the city has to figure out.
I mean, we do have a conditional use tool in our zoning, donāt we?
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More police to enforce strict no loitering policies would be one area to start. I do think adding more lighting would help as well. At least half of the arrests for drugs and firearms in that area are actually on the outskirts of Glenwood Ave tho (a block or 2 to the east or west and on Peace St.
In related news regarding businesses walking awayā¦today Square Burger (only business within Moore Square) announced they will be closing in January. I would have to imagine crime was at least a factor in that decision.
I think they can start with ALE to make sure bars arenāt serving underage patrons and shut them down if they are.
This is what finally took care of Club Bodi in the warehouse district when it was a menace to the neighborhood and even became a āgentlemanās clubā after hours in the last few years of itās life.
Itās one tool in the toolbox, but I think there are other things that can be done. Not allowing clubs to keep people queued up indefinitely on the sidewalk if the place is at capacity may be another one. Time to get creative.
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There should have been zoning conditions when things like cornerstone went through rezoning &/or change of use. The City was trying to jumpstart the area and let things go. Should not have let a house turn into bar as you know if would mean expanding into outside patio etc. Too much of a good thing and boom.
My family and I moved here last year because were so excited about the prospect of a safe, walkable, family-friendly, mid-size downtown. We were so excited to contribute to downtown by walking everywhere and patronizing the local businesses but the unfortunate reality is it just doesnāt feel safe or family friendly. Safety is a clear concern when spending time near Moore Square/Fayetteville Street and family friendliness is a issue with Glenwood South. So we now find ourselves rarely going downtown. Iād be surprised if I was the only one that felt this was.
Clean up downtown or people are going to avoid it, business are going to leave and downtown raleigh will become a ghost town.
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Also make sure that alcohol should not be sold past 2am. And have police on segways to come and intervene if a situation breaks out, that would help if Glenwood became pedestrian-only on Fridays and Saturday nights. To break up brawls and shootings, In Austin they have that lot of cops on patrol hereās an example.
It wasnāt just one āhouseā; itās a row of them.
When I bought my condo, that row was individual businesses, and none of them were late night bars.
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