(((I usually only go on weekend days)))
The more kids and less energy contrast to MSFH is a perfect counter balance. With a 3 week old propped up on my arm right now, that is my new go-to sort of place. But I always preferred more chill places anyway (not the fake Glenwood āchill loungeā BS). I think Transfer will have a more loyal customer base in the long haul and less turnover of merchants as a result.
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I think heās saying it went from gritty, organic and creative to clean/glossy, trendy/āpopularā. FWIW, the Glenwood area has more active warehouses than the Warehouse district now.(I mean, it also was a warehouse district too). Creamery, Google, 42nd St, Clouds, Tobacco Road, Several tiny structures still being used. I actually like its physical form better as it stands now.
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MSFH seems to attract the same crowd as Niallās other venues or Cornerstone, thus more Glenwood South than Warehouse feel (unfortunately imo)
By the way Barcelona, Transfer Co, Brewery Bhavana are early signs that Raleigh is growing up beyond college bar scene atmosphere to more trendy/young professional.
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Yep.
So, hereās the problem with talking about the growth of our city in ways that disparage clean and glossy, etc. Itās the only way that a city like Raleigh grows its downtown.
Raleigh simply does not have block after block after block of abandoned & interesting buildings to restore. If we want to grow our downtown, clean and glossy is our future.
Even Transfer Co. has clean and glossy townhouses next door to it. If it wants to be the catalyst to future development around it, that too will likely be clean and glossy. Otherwise, it remains somewhat orphaned on the edge of low density housing that is currently its dominant context.
IMO, Raleighās best play is to do its best to retain its small collection of āhistoricā buildings, much like Transfer did. But, letās not fool ourselves, when we grow, we are going to get a lot of clean and glossy.
As for the āsceneā in Glenwood South, which I suspect is more of whatās being ātalked around the edgesā here, that too will change and mature as the cityās urban and dense neighborhoods mature with more retail and services typically associated with them. Just look how Weaver Street is changing the dynamic of the sidewalk experience in the Warehouse District.
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Iāll own up to not liking pop culture, popular things and when areas get too popular. 400 people waiting in line to get in the same club to hear a DJ spinning the same stuff as the most popular club in other other cities just isnāt my thing. Never was at age 22, and isnāt now at 45. Iāve always been a fan of combining creative adaptation of buildings and genuine infill around those buildings. (note, infill does not involve demolition of something and building bigger as high dollar developers like to try and tell you). I do think Transferās condos are way too expensive and I have plenty of beef with Queen, but he got significant involvement from some of his vendors in how the whole thing was to turn out and as a result the end product reflects the vendors ideas as much as it does his. Anyway, I think the gunning for the absolute highest dollar all over town now is going to (is/has) kill the low dollar creative stuff. The small scale stuff I tend to prefer. There are exceptions of course. The shine and new isnāt as big of problem as much as the seemingly inevitable loss of the other stuff I like. Few landlords altruistically let businesses stay (though Empire has done that, love them or hate them) because GD dollar runs everything.
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Trade offs in every thing / preference out there. My preference is for the vibe Transfer created in how the townhomes reference the Food Hall and I personally like how the mod juxtaposes the ārefreshedā garage. I totally respect your point about their location adjacent to a SFH crossfire. Hopefully their community push is honest as it seems on the surface. Thats a convo for another thread, perhaps.
Transfer feels completely different to me than Niallās stuff and he benefits from greater collateral development around his spots and still cheaps out. Heās making money no doubt - just not mine. Iāve spent time around Glenwood South for going on 3 decades, so I use GloSo as a moniker for how Iām still waiting for it to grow up so I want to hang out more than 3 or 4 places that put some heart and soul into it.
What Iām saying about the warehouse district is that the jury is still out on where it lands as it evolves but my fear is too many places leaning into appearance rather than soul.
Iām not bashing your āhood, just my 2 centsā¦
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I agree with you regarding losing what we have, and what makes all cities interesting. As is the case with nearly all growing cities, itās the trailblazer and small operator that gets pushed out first. Kind of ironic.
We have to make room for small business owners and entrepreneurs, much like the food halls do by offering a small footprint business model. There needs to be more of this in other places. We need more retail the size of North Street Beer Station and smaller. We need to investigate kiosks in places between places like under the new Capital Blvd bridge over Peace Street. We need to encourage the crate businesses that are slated for the plaza between 1 Glenwood and 2 Hillsborough. We need to make sure that every parcel isnāt gigantic and set up for chain retailers.
The outgoing council became obsessed with AH as a leverage mechanism. I hope that the incoming council will think about these other issues/details as well, and not go down the rabbit hole left open by their predecessors.
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For all the talk about āaffordable housingā, Iād love to hear a conversation about āaffordable businessā. Street fairs and the like are nice and all, but I feel like it would be nice to see something more permanent like what @John is talking about.
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John, North Street Beer Station is pretty awesome. Was a go-to when I lived over in Brooklyn.
Tenkai, this crossed my mind a few timesā¦in NYC I can find tacos for $2 a piece. They sell hundreds, maybe even a thousand a day. But the apartments overhead cost $6000-8000 a month. How on earth do these $2 taco places exist in NYC? I would like to knowā¦are there city incentives to include retail? Does the tenant bear the brunt of the fix -up and taxes on the space? Do landlords just make the concession to tilt the rent towards the residential side and more or less have them subsidize the retail because, well, the city needs to have food?
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A lot of unpaid worker hours. $2 taco places in high rent places probably family run with āretiredā family members helping out the business.
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Maybe, the $1 slice places in NYC come to mind too. I asked one of the workers in a $1 slice place how they stay open last time I was there. He told me they pump out 100s of cheese pizzas a day, and they cost about a $1 in ingredients or less because of limited menu items and bulk purchasing.
I would assume the taco places are the same.
Lets say a $1 slice place puts out 200 pizzas a day. that is $1600 Revenue a day x 7 = 11,200 a week. If they can keep costs down, it seems profitable, especially since the bigger $1 slice places are selling more then that.
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Yeah itās all about volume. Luckily no one just eats 1 taco.
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Yep. Itās all about volume. But, itās also about low overhead. Thatās why we need small footprint retail spaces. Itās the secret sauce to making small businesses work in an urban environment. For these pizza places with cheap slices, itās basically a walk up business to take away food as you walk. There might be some sort of small standing counter, or some tables on the sidewalk, but thatās usually it.
My favorite example of this type of business is LaSandwicherie in South Beach. Their store is a long narrow storefront on the back of a building facing the end of an alley. If I had to guess, the footprint of the business is like 7-8 feet wide by about 50 feet long, with service only being over a counter to the outside. Most customers take the sandwiches to go, while the lucky few, who are able to grab a stool, belly up to the pass counter to eat there.
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A freestanding Burger King in Raleigh doesnāt make a whole lot more than that. Maybe double or triple (I used to manage one). I guess those one trick pony places in NYC really really keep the costs down to make it work. Iām glad they do. Its always awesome food and refreshing after dropping $300 a night on very basic rooms. I wonder what the business plans look like in Transfer? The artisan places sacrifice volume to some degree.
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Just ate there last month. Good sandwiches. Wish Raleigh had some walk up type places like this.
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Great interview with Nick Neptune, General Mgr of Transfer Co. on Podcast Raleigh.
Talks about 2 1/2 story Saxapahaw Grocery starting construction in 2020 and other insights.
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Did he say when in 2020? With a child in tow, Transfer has been a lifesaver for to just get out of the house for a bite and a beer. Sax would be incredible from my perspective.
Did not say when in 2020, but sounds like the plan is in place. Just no room to stage grocery store construction right now. Currently the construction equipment building this last phase of townhomes is sometimes parked where the grocery will be. I have a townhome under construction, and the completion date is end of February, so it should start shortly after. Already noticing big equipment being moved out now that townhome exteriors are complete.
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