Possible New Development Locations and Projects - Rezonings

If the property owners wanted to maintain their views by preventing high rise development next door they are perfectly capable of buying a negative easement from the adjacent landowners that preserves the sight lines. But they didn’t do that, and now they want to use the coercive power of government to get that thing for free. Call me crazy but people living in expensive high rise condos are not model recipients of that kind of intervention.

I’m genuinely confused why you seem to think the developer should have to try and compromise at all on this. No matter how much they tried to get together and say kumbaya with the condo owners, they very clearly would be running against a brick wall.

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Which is the whole point of why they’ve focused on the effects the tower could have on traffic, and tried to claim that there isn’t nearby transit. I agree with John that it’s clear they’re not being honest about what they want and that I’d prefer them to just state it outright - since then it would be obvious that their concerns are not worth considering in a downtown environment.

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Exactly. The non-BS conversation would go like this:

City: “Why do you disagree with rezoning this lot to 40 stories?”
Quorum residents: “Because we like our current view and don’t want to see a new building in our view.”
City: “Gotcha. Well unfortunately that doesn’t matter whatsoever in the grand scheme of things, dismissed. Rezoning approved.”

End of discussion.

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Seriously… I cannot think of a less worthy reason to deny a downtown property’s rezoning.

Well you don’t have to apologize to me, I’m agreeing with you :sweat_smile:

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1000% agree. Don’t even know why this issue is given the time of day

I’ll say this again. Its already zoned 20 floors so whatever the developer builds “by right” would already impact them the same as anything with another 15 floors. In fact, probably their best bet for a more attractive building adjacent to them is for a 35 story building which would likely face more appearance scrutiny as a signature tower.

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RIGHT - has this point been made to them? That 20 stories could and very well may end up being even taller than Quorum Center, which I believe is 15 stories of residential? They’ve already lost their view LMAO

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This is exactly the point that I made with the board of my HOA. A building will be built, and an ask for a rezoning, or variance, or whatever it is called is an opportunity for adjacent property owners to have a voice in the process.
IMO, not wanting to negotiate with the developer and help shape how the 35 floors will be achieved is a mistake and is likely counterproductive to what the Quorum would like to see happen. If the developer and the owners at Quorum got together and hammered out an agreement that satisfied both, the city’s job would be a lot easier and a lot quicker.

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My post in this topic was not intended to elicit angry responses, and all of the “all caps” in this reply to me suggests that I failed in that regard. I’m sorry that I failed.

Yes. I live in the city; I have only lived in urban context condos for the last 26 years. I’m not new to the game or the experience of city living and I am very much pro-growth within the urban context. I suspect that any resident of downtown that put their “money where their mouth is” by buying feels similarly.

However my experiences with urban living, being in HOAs, and even what I do for work daily tells me that picking a side without regard to the other is rarely a pleasant or fruitful strategy. IMO, better ideas come when thoughtful people who disagree come together to solve problems.

I also know that the idea of high density development and maintaining some sort of quality of life (even views) aren’t mutually exclusive ideas. You can have both. The reality is that views do matter to a lot of people, and it’s both a reason why we build high-rise living, and it’s the reason why people will pay more to live higher in such buildings. It’s personally not my motivator and I’ve never lived above the 5th floor anywhere, but it’s a big deal to a lot of people. It’s also important to the city because these high dollar residents pay $$$ in property taxes. They are way more valuable to a city’s bottom line than someone living in a McMansion on newly minted infrastructure.

Others care a lot about traffic as well, and it’s difficult for some people to understand that walkable density doesn’t create traffic like non-walkable suburbia. It’s clearly a go-to strategy to use fear of massive change to get others on your side when you are actually going mano a mano with another entity. This is why these nebulous and “scary” topics come up.

Change is very difficult for a lot of people, and fear is powerful tool to prevent change. We see this in our politics and knee-jerk reaction laws that are based in fear of “the other” or a perception that I better strike first before I get victimized, etc. How we get to acceptance of change starts with listening, and listening again, and listening some more. You really don’t get past something any other way.

Right now, and going on 3 years now, the voices being heard are almost exclusively the developers’ voices, and that is likely a backlash to many years of “council of no” decision making when the voices were nearly exclusively those who are fearful and those resisting change. If we don’t look for the balance and show that Raleigh can grow by being an example of people working together, we are just going to have that pendulum swing back to the council of no. That could very well happen in this year’s election. If that happens, we shouldn’t be surprised if potential projects like this one get caught up in administrative red tape and reviews intended to kill it. Now, if the residents and the developer came to council with a unified voice, that project is much more likely to survive and move forward under any administration.

It is such an awful thing to want to see these two sides come together and find a creative solution together?

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hahaha hey man, no anger directed at you at all. My “all-caps” are strictly for E M P H A S I S. I know you’re mainly playing devil’s advocate, so I’m more responding to the Quorum residents themselves through your post.

I’m all for equity but it feels this attorney ‘representing’ the Quorum appears to be negotiating in bad faith and mostly from a selfish (and unrealistic in my opinion) point of view IMO. Surely a rational person who lives in a downtown area of a growing city like Raleigh would accept that something like this might happen down the line?

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Bingo. The argument that there aren’t enough transit stops nearby to justify denser zoning is simply incorrect, as @haus_of_chad so succinctly showed. It is inarguable. They just straight up don’t want a new building in their view, a non-argument, and are grasping at straws to say anything but that truth.

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I think the city council is pretty much not buying it from either the Quorum Center representative and the ‘too close to the church’ argument as well. City council members even mentioned that the only part of Quorum Center that abuts this project is the Quorum Center parking deck structure–cars don’t need nice views. And that the only church property that abuts this project is a surface parking lot.

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Was on the docket for a public hearing again today but has been pushed to June 21 so the owner can keep working with the church and neighbors. Sigh… Lol.

Those damn Quorom Center residents :sweat_smile:

This is insane. Why are the “neighbors’” “concerns” being given the time of day? It’s completely disingenuous.

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The rezoning at 300 West Edenton passed. 35-story height limit. Cox, Knight, and Buffkin opposed.

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Once there’s a development announcement, we can track it in its own thread.

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Is this our first mid-level rezoning? Like not 20, 30, or 40?

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