Smoky Hollow Phases 1, 2, and 3

[GucciLittlePig]

@atl_transplant

My 2nd huge concern is the intersection with West and Johnson. How this isn’t a 4-way really confuses me. If you’re coming down Johnson, you can’t even see the vehicles on West. Also, if we’re saying WB Johnson off Capital is important enough to have free flow, then how is it minor enough to have two-way stop at West. Also if it’s major enough to get a light at Glenwood, how is it minor enough to have a two-way stop at West.

Yes. Exactly this. Completely dumbfounded that someone let this develop this way.

[John]

@atl_transplant

My 2nd huge concern is the intersection with West and Johnson. How this isn’t a 4-way really confuses me. If you’re coming down Johnson, you can’t even see the vehicles on West.

The utility poles on the SW corner of that intersection make it impossible to see north bound traffic on West from the east bound stop sign on Johnson. It’s been a problem forever, even when SH wasn’t there. You literally have to semi pull into the intersection to even see if a car is coming. At the very least this power pole issue needs to be resolved because a driver trying to pay attention to the problems this causes can’t possibly be paying enough attention to pedestrians in the area. Also, REAL crosswalks need to be installed that force West traffic to yield as folks make their way on foot from Glenwood to SH and vice versa. I’ve said it before, but I’d love to see a mini roundabout in this location with crosswalks pulled away from the actual intersection, but I doubt we’d be able to get that.

[orulz]

@atl_transplant

At the VERY least, both of these need to be made 4-way stops before it’s too late. Eventually with SH growing up, these will probably warrant signals.

With the density and activity here, these intersections are almost certainly guaranteed to meet the (very high) MUTCD warrants based on pedestrian traffic alone.

[atl_transplant]

Curious if @pierretong may have any insights as to what the city had been thinking here with the setup and if the city listens to citizen complaints / feedback.

I’m guessing it was just a case of lack of coordination between NCDOT who did the Capital Blvd interchange, the new leg of Johnson St that was added probably by the city with SH and the city who just put up the signal on Glenwood.

[Deekay93]

Can’t make this. But maybe we’ll get some insight on what’s up with the retail/restaurants going here.

[Deekay93]

This is perfect. I’ll definitely send out a few emails with concerns

[John]

I’m going to sign up for the 5PM tour.
Anyone else interested in that time slot?

Edit: I signed up.

[pierretong]

I don’t have any insight into how that decision was made because that was before I even started working in the area but I also concur with your complaints about Johnson Street

Edit: Asked my coworker who was at NCDOT Congestion Management when the project went through his group and he recalled there being an extreme queue in the model inbound that went around the corner and onto SB Capital that led to the decision to have a free flowing ingress…

2nd Edit: The firm that did the traffic analysis for the interchange (an unnamed large engineering firm in downtown Raleigh) also is responsible for the 3-way stop at a 4-way intersection at the Raleigh Wegmans/Trader Joe’s

[pBeez]

Thanks for the insight!!

[GucciLittlePig]

@pierretong

The firm that did the traffic analysis for the interchange (an unnamed large engineering firm in downtown Raleigh) also is responsible for the 3-way stop at a 4-way intersection at the Raleigh Wegmans/Trader Joe’s

Which is also a complete clusterf*ck since half the people coming in stop anyways and then the traffic behind them builds up, so no one waiting at the stop signs ever gets a chance to go. Not to mention multiway stops seem to confuse everyone down here as much as rotaries…

[OakCityDylan]

I got 5:30p for @OakCityKarla and I. Hang out after your tour and we’ll grab a bev.

[atl_transplant]

Interesting. Not to get too far off track but it makes a bit more sense at the wegmans and plaza entrances in general because usually traffic from a double left turn signal funnels in all at once at its typically close to the signal where the 3-way stop would be.

But in this case I wonder what kind of volume estimates they had that made a queue that long? I’ve never seen more than like 2-3 vehicles coming off at once.

[pierretong]

gotta love traffic forecasting…

[Kanatenah]

I agree. I hate that Wegmans entrance. All it takes is a few confused people to find it all up. There has got to be a better way to manage that hot mess.

[John]

@Kanatenah

to find it all up

someone’s autocorrect is keeping it G rated.

[trueurbanist]

Is anyone else concerned about the lack of retail spots opening at smoky hollow?

[atl_transplant]

Takes some time to get going in totally new spaces sometimes. Most of these will probably be small businesses which their owners take a while to plan so just coming off COVID a lot of potential owners probably had their plans held back. I’m thinking we’ll start to see movement soon as the economy strengthens.

[jclem26112]

anyone go to this and can provide some intel?

[evan.j.bost]

Just walked through. There are a ton of spots in there, and it’s really going to take a ground swell of tenants to create a district in there. I think the design of the interior facing patio creates a situation where no one wants to open first

[OakCityDylan]

We did a tour of it this afternoon and they’re telling us they have a decent amount of not only interest but confirm tenants. I am guessing it won’t be even close to half full but at least enough tenants to start activating the streets. Retail interest is exploding from what they’re saying, not lackluster for commercial, surprise.